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Originally Posted by foundit66 1) If your mother had given you her wedding dress first, as a present, do you think her reaction would be any different?
Seriously now. Her reaction WOULD NOT center around the fact that the dress was "hers", but rather on what it MEANS to her...
2) "attached sentimental value"?
Do you understand that we have "attached sentimental value" to the flag?
1) "property" has nothing to do with this. You keep coming up with red herrings...
2) "fashion I don't approve of". Yes.
3) "disrespecting". It's not so much as HE IS disrespecting, as much as he is committing an ACTION that is disrespectful. Or, that I see as disrespectful.
But the thing is that it's not an "image that looks just like her wedding dress".
It IS my flag. It's his flag. It's the nation's flag. All of it in a symbolic way... |
Perhaps I'm not getting the point across that I hoped. I understand that you hold some sort of symbolic attachment to the floormat flag, and I understand that you feel he's disrespecting it. And of course that is your opinion.
But your opinion sucks. I mean, why do you care whether Bush steps on a doormat colored like a flag? Nothing bad will happen. Your property isn't being destroyed. Bush isn't intentionally disrespectful. So why do you care?
If Bush were stepping on a floormat colored slightly differently, no one would mind. Because the doormat is colored in this fashion, your mind conjures up bad symbolism. But it's just symbolism: It's not real; it's just in your mind. So put it out of your mind. What is real is that Bush is stepping on a floormat, doesn't mean any disrespect, and isn't causing any harm.
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And as for your example, do you have any friends who are married (or preferrably recently married) who you could suggest that type of "gift" too?
See if they don't think it's tacky.
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They might think it is tacky, if they thought that I was intentionally trying to disrespect them. But in the end, I think it would come down to my intentions.
Let's look at another example. Let's imagine I put a movie star's handprints and name into a piece of concrete on the ground in Hollywood. Then people come through and walk on it. Is that disrespectful? It is not, because it is well understood that I am trying to honor that star and preserve that star's memory.
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The very action is disrespectful in our eyes.
I've got black friends at work who I might jokingly refer to with the "n-word". I wouldn't mean any disrespect, but he might not agree with my usage.
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Now, this is a bit difficult because, the n-word's meaning is pretty much offensive. But if you were using it in a fashion which truly did not intend offense, and truly did not express some belief that black people are inferior, then why should they be angry? Is it simply because a taboo word was spoken? That's no big deal, it's just sound waves. It is the intention of the speaker, and the effects of his words that matter.
The flag reminds me of certain real events, and thinking of those real events may make me feel some emotion. But burning the flag doesn't change those events, and when I see a burning flag, or a flag being stepped on, I think of those very same events. Why should my emotion be different? It isn't the symbol that is important, it is the real events behind the symbol.
The soldier's victory in Iwo Jima is far more important than the raising of the flag. Had they instead placed a giant sign which read, "American forces now occupy this base", the event would have been no less important. But because they placed a flag, and that a famous monument of that event was created, the flag now reminds me of Iwo Jima.
In the same fashion, the events that happend on 9-11 are fare more important than the raising of a flag. But because the flag was displayed prominantly during 9-11, the flag reminds me of 9-11.
The flag is just an object that reminds us of real events. Disrespecting or destroying the reminder doesn't change those events. If I burn the flag, I have not burned America, I have not burned Americans, I have not burned our soliders, and I have not burned those who died on 9-11. All I have done is burn a piece of cloth, and even though that piece of cloth
reminds us of something, no harm has been caused.
So don't confuse a symbol with reality. The meaning of a symbol is all in your mind, it's all in what it reminds you of. Destroying a symbol is not the same thing as destroying what it reminds you of.