Well see, I'm actually glad you brought up these points because it shows exactly why we need a greater tolerance of socialism in the United States. That is, socialism is way too often confused with communism in this country.

Many socialists are democratic (especially the democratic socialists [duh]). Trotsky, Marx, Lenin, and Mao were all communist, and the difference between their individual ideologies was varying beliefs of social control (obviously Mao was completely totalitarian while Marx was radically democratic). But they were all much radically different than socialists. Socialism is a mixed economy, and communism is a purely planned economy (or shared I should say). Socialists dislike communism just as much, and in most cases, more than capitalism.

I agree that the current political landscape of the United States (just after Goldwater conservatism) doesn't leave very much room for socialist ideas. However, the American political landscape has changed dramatically on a number of different issues in its history and I don't see why socialism should be left out as a possibility for tolerance in the future; esspecially considering the country has been on a progressive path ever since its conception: gradually but surely moving to the left.

I also agree that individualism is an American tradition. And including in that sense of individualism is a sense of independent financial responsibility. That is, Americans believe in equal opportunity as opposed to equal outcomes. And even as someone who considers himself to have many socialist beliefs, I believe in the same thing. Its just that I think socialist ideas can help each American truely get equal opportunity. Socialism helps give people born into truely inconducive and counterproductive environments or situations a little help so that they actually have equal opportunity just as other Americans get. Obviously even after the days of civil rights and segregation, we still have vastly unequal public education. So in other words, socialists think they have the answer for true equal opportunity. So actually, some socialist ideas can actually be a very American thing, and I don't see why it should be left out for tolerance.

But obviously, I think we need a lot of work before we get to a more socialistic point. I think the first thing we need to do is provide equal education opportunities so that people in poor neighborhoods are much better educated and equiped for success, and subsequently much less likely to abuse the system. Likewise we need to come up with a better way of deciding who abuses and who uses the systems.

Communism is what preaches equal outcomes. Communists want to eliminate completely private property and classes. That is definitly something socialists disagree with.

Although you bring up an interesting point with economic productivity, I still think socialism needs to stand the test of time. But obviously Scandinavian countries aren't doing worse because of their economic system, but because they are significantly smaller, and power isn't centralized in their hands. But if you think of their population and their size in relation to their standard of living, their's is considerably higher than ours.

But you shouldn't view national success by GDP in the first place. You should view national success by the standard of living and overall quality of life. This is why studies place the United States only in the teens in "top countries to live in" (BBC). Because wealth and power does not always connotate quality of life.

As a great man once put it before:

“The gross national product includes air pollution and advertising for cigarettes, and ambulances to clear our highways of carnage. It counts special locks for our doors, and jails for the people who break them. The gross national product includes the destruction of the redwoods and the death of Lake Superior. It grows with the production of napalm and missiles with nuclear warheads....

“And if the gross national product includes all this, there is much that it does not comprehend. It does not allow for the health of our families, the quality of their education, or the joy of their play. It is indifferent to the decency of our factories and the safety of streets alike. It does not include the beauty of our poetry or the strength of our marriages, the intelligence of our public debate or the integrity of our public officials....

“The gross national product measures neither our wit nor our courage, neither our wisdom nor our learning, neither our compassion nor our devotion to country. It measures everything, in short, except that which makes life worthwhile; and it can tell us everything about America -- except why we are proud to be Americans."
-Robert F. Kennedy