I am not just spouting this stuff off, believe me. I have been involved in this mess for the last 17 years. I know the ins and the outs of the whole situation, intimately. I have sat there with victims, crying their hearts out, with families telling them to just shut up and it'll all go away. I've tried to convince recalcitrant victims to testify to no avail. I've had to turn around and seek prosecution of people who've made up stories of abuse against innocent people. I've waited in the Emergency room to find out if I'm going to get a statement from a mangled vivtim, or if it'll be the Medical Examiner instead.

I've seen victims overcome the "taint," and I've seen them commit suicide. I've recommended counselling, and I've paid for abused women to hide, then move on, just to see them seek out, and get into another abusive relationship.

It doesn't stop. In regards to abusive relationships, did you know that only 25% of men are abusive, but 75% of women have been abused? However, with the current generation, I think the percentages are going up, not down.

To OhDear. No, sweetie, most of the child abuse cases are male-male, most of the ones in the news are male-female. Just a happy aside, there. Boys, having the male, macho thing going on, rarely admit to having been abused, so our mutual friend is sort of a hero in that regard, He did something about it. Not the typical thing. Also, most child molesting is committed within the family, or at least family friends.

What the whole point of this thread was meant to be, was a discussion about options, because what we have now sure ain't working. Violence, or no violence, the fact is, crimes against women, and especially children are on the increase.I don't presume to know the answers, I do, however know that the system, the way it is now, is not working. I also know that before civil rights issues for inmates, and the "Touchy-Feely" way of doing things nowadays in a big flop. We need to be tougher on crime, and criminals. They certainly don't need or deserve a "free ride."

The whole idea that violence is not "Civilized," misses the point that crime is not civilized, and that criminals don't function on the same level as civilized humans. They understand power. The use of power, and the abuse of it. They live their lives abusing the system, and thereby gaining power over the populace. I don't recommend of condone abuse of power, but folks, we better start using our power judiciously, or our Society is going down the drain in the next couple of generations. Sometimes it takes uncivilized behavior, applied judiciously to obtain civilized results.