hk, since you say you’re not a history buff I will tell you more of what happened in the Baltic. See the fact is the UN would do nothing. The UN screamed bloody murder about NATO going in and putting a stop to the murdering antics happening there. America did not have to put itself in danger or harms way. This is very recent history.

The UN is neither capable nor willing to take care of mass murderers. It is much easier for them to be indecisive, watch innocent people die by the thousand, make excuses of why they should not do anything and then try to place the blame on others for atrocities after the facts. I would hope all Americans will remain as I do and say screw the UN. This world is not going to be one nation. You will have poor always. The hope would be that enough just minded people are gathered that have the power to defend and to protect the poor and those who are inable and unable to defend themselves. Personally I think the nations that are muslim should gather together enough people to defend the innocent in Iraq and any other nation in that region against the insurgent militants and whacko "fundos" as you call them. I do not see that happening because you see they would rather veiw someone else do it from a distance just like you are now. You fail to even mention what is transpiring in Africa as we speak. Those lovely muslims are over there hacking and whacking people to pieces with machetes. What is the UN doing about it??? Not a thing.

Take your own children out of their schools and seminaries and send them in there in these places to be slaughtered, bombed and mangled while attempting to protect the innocent and set a stage for a self sufficent government from whacko "fundos". Then you can say we did it not the Americans. Because slamming the US is all you are after here in this forum. Your disdain for America shows through your innaccurate and false claims. You should have been taking the high ground first to protect the innocent in your regions and others but you didn't.

The fact is this, others who are in a US voluntary military are over there working, being mangled and dying daily to protect, train and defend Iraqi citizens. Wow, think of that. They don't have to be there in harms way but they are. They have gone into the military to help others in a foriegn country have a free society. Not just the rich, elite and uppercrust but they are there for the poor also. Our churches are also gathering people, money, food and supplies and sending them into the country. And all you want to do is slam accussations at the US.

It is this simple. If in fact you want peace, then you and the others like you need to get hold of the nutcases of your religion and put a stop to them. I am sure this has already been said and it will probably be said again.

You have exhibited that you have plenty of time to write on this forum. Take some of that energy and start a coalition of what you claim to be peaceful muslims to change your part of the world.

Osama was not merely hiding in Afghanistan, he and his cronies had taken over there. For the record, I will stand on what my husband has already said.

"If you check facts and figures you will find the millions upon millions of dollars the US expended to train, equip and educate the Iranian military. They had no formal nor tactical concept to enable them to wage modern warfare. The United States trained the Iranian Air Force. This is fact. Your explanation is incomplete, inconsistent and misguided. The US did not assassinate the Shaw of Iran. He cared about his people and his nation and he died for his people. He is your martyr.

During World War II, who were the US's allies in the region you are speaking of? The change did not come from the United States meddling. It came from power hungry local nations vying for control in the areas you have just mentioned. Our military was put on alert when the Ayatollah instructed his radicals to seize the US embassy in Iran. This alert happened before any hostages were taken. If we were going to "meddle" as you say, this would have been the opportune time to do so. You need to go back and research you history.

My husband was a part of that alert. He was assigned to a rapid deployment force that had world wide reactionary capabilities. That fighter squadron he was assigned to was in fact mustered. The squadron was launched with all support services including electronic warfare. After the squadron was scrambled, this mission was scrapped and ALL aircraft and support units were recalled and ordered to return to base.

My husband was one of those GI's who was restricted to his quarters while the muslim's were allowed to trash an airbase with which they were being trained to support their country. My husband was told by his base commander that the Iranians were just blowing smoke. My husband and twelve men were told at that time in 1978 that the muslim nation would own and control the United States of America. He was told that to his face by a muslim radical Iranian Air Force Captain who was on this airbase as a guest. This Iranian Captains explanation for his peoples actions were that the Shaw was a puppet for the United States. You would do well to remember that the Iranians were in this country as a guest to receive training. Do not think for one moment that these nationals were only from Iran. We are talking Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, the whole ball of wax. Now you tell me and you convince my husband that this Iranian Captain got this idea on his own before the American hostages were taken in Tehran.

The world is fortunate that those planes were called back. They were going out to destroy not to protect. The American hostages were taken after those planes were called back. Now you tell me who was trying to exercise control.

American servicemen were restricted to quarters while foreign nationals were trying to trash a United States airbase. These sons of bitches were screaming death to America in 1978 on our soil. Our GI's were forced to do nothing. Not even raise a finger in a gesture. This whole incident was never publicly revealed. My husband does not like muslims. They threaten to kill him and his family and take over his country in 1978. His government would not allow him to do anything about it. He is sick of the crap spewed about the peaceful muslim nation. People think muslims want Israel off the map. The only way this can happen is if they take the US out first.

My husband says f.... the muslims. The US will not hold off forever. This is the land of milk and honey. It was created not for allah but for GOD. One Nation under HIM. You would do well to remember that.

My husband is considered "old" by the younger generation. This is nothing new. He viewed our nations leaders as old and ineffective in 1978. How long does the world expect God to wait?"

And agree with what KM stated:

"Let me also add, as for the apathetic or liberal view on war or 'a human need to fight the good fight against evil' let me add a couple of things...
"FREEDOM IS NEVER MORE THAN ONE GENERATION AWAY FROM EXTINCTION. WE DID NOT PASS IT TO OUR CHILDREN IN THE BLOODSTREAM. IT MUST BE FOUGHT FOR, PROTECTED, AND HANDED ON FOR THEM TO DO THE SAME, OR ONE DAY WE WILL SPEND OUR SUNSET YEARS TELLING OUR CHILDREN WHAT IT ONCE WAS LIKE IN THE U.S. WHERE MEN WERE FREE...."-RONALD REGAN
This applies to all countries that value freedom, peace and democracy. There have and always will be people/terrorists that wish to dominate/reform/eliminate people not of their beliefs....GENGIS KHAN; TAMERLANE; YUAN; CEASAR; STALIN; HITLER; BUSHI;
As for the U.S. meddling in other countries affairs when they are not wanted...
WW1- GERMANY, AUSTRIA-HUNGARY AGAINST EUROPE.(ABSOLUTE POWERS & CENTRAL POWERS)
AUG.4,1914 PRESIDENT WILSON ISSUED A PROCLAMATION OF NEUTRALITY.
MAY 7,1915, THE BRITISH LINER 'LUSITANIA' WAS HIT AND KILLED 128 AMERICANS, STILL AMERICA DID NOT OFFICIALLY PARTICIPATE UNTIL APRIL 6,1917.
WW2-1939-1945 GERMANY AGAINST 32 COUNTRIES. THE U.S DID NOT JOIN THIS WAR UNTIL DEC.7, 1941 AFTER JAPANESE CARRIERS HIT PEARL HARBOR.
**LET ME REITERATE THAT THERE ARE PEACEFUL PEOPLE IN ALL NATIONS, THEN THERE ARE THOSE THAT ARE RADICALS.....**
Most interpreters of the Koran find no arguments in it for the murder of innocents. But it would be naive to ignore in Islam a deep thread of intolerance toward unbelievers, especially if those unbelievers are believed to be a threat to the Islamic world. There are many passages in the Koran urging mercy toward others, tolerance, respect for life and so on. But there are also passages as violent as this: "And when the sacred months are passed, kill those who join other gods with God wherever ye shall find them; and seize them, besiege them, and lay wait for them with every kind of ambush." And this: "Believers! Wage war against such of the infidels as are your neighbors, and let them find you rigorous." Bernard Lewis, the great scholar of Islam, writes of the dissonance within Islam: "There is something in the religious culture of Islam which inspired, in even the humblest peasant or peddler, a dignity and a courtesy toward others never exceeded and rarely equaled in other civilizations. And yet, in moments of upheaval and disruption, when the deeper passions are stirred, this dignity and courtesy toward others can give way to an explosive mixture of rage and hatred which impels even the government of an ancient and civilized country -- even the spokesman of a great spiritual and ethical religion -- to espouse kidnapping and assassination, and try to find, in the life of their prophet, approval and indeed precedent for such actions." Since Muhammad was, unlike many other religious leaders, not simply a sage or a prophet but a ruler in his own right, this exploitation of his politics is not as great a stretch as some would argue.
This use of religion for extreme repression, and even terror, is not of course restricted to Islam. For most of its history, Christianity has had a worse record. From the Crusades to the Inquisition to the bloody religious wars of the 16th and 17th centuries, Europe saw far more blood spilled for religion's sake than the Muslim world did. And given how expressly nonviolent the teachings of the Gospels are, the perversion of Christianity in this respect was arguably greater than bin Laden's selective use of Islam. But it is there nonetheless. It seems almost as if there is something inherent in religious monotheism that lends itself to this kind of terrorist temptation. And our bland attempts to ignore this -- to speak of this violence as if it did not have religious roots -- is some kind of denial. We don't want to denigrate religion as such, and so we deny that religion is at the heart of this. But we would understand this conflict better, perhaps, if we first acknowledged that religion is responsible in some way, and then figured out how and why."

Then again say, if you are what you claim to be do something there in the region where you live. Put your energies into changing the situations of your people where you live. Since you say that it is the young poor who are misdirected into these hate groups, start groups to help them learn hatred and violence is not the way. You claimed in posts, "there are no muslim fundos on this site to fix" so put your energy into an area where you can fix some of them.

To walk away and not give the people of Iraq an established government that can and will care for all of the people of Iraq would be a catastrophe at this point. The fact is American troops are already there and as much as, "We the people would rather have them home". They are not. They are attempting to create a stable environment for the people of Iraq can have a free choice society. All you want to do from the appearances of all your negative posts about America is to slam the US and claim we are self-righteous and you think you stand on the high ground from your computer. If in fact you are standing on the high ground to the road to peace then you need to take a stand from where you are and work to make a change there. You are the one living in that region.


Plus one more thing hk. If you are going to make quotes do not try to make your words look like mine in a quote box. For I know you have alterior motives and this conversation is over. I retain again my husband's sentiments.