Defending the Truth

Exactly what is the point in giving the father a "say" if his "say" is less than the 50% majority required to make the decision? If the man and woman have a relationship, it is likely the man will have some imput. Sometimes there is no relationship, or it is dangerous for the woman to involve the father.

The male partner involved in legal abortion -- Kero et al. 14 (10): 2669 -- Human Reproduction
"Studies investigating men in abortion situations are extremely rare. Most studies of legal abortion are focused on the women and when abortion and contraception are discussed, attention is mostly centred on the role and responsibility of the woman. Hospital staff often meet only the woman and not the man in cases of legal abortion, which can result in the risk of abortion being regarded solely as a female issue. Thus, the participation of the man remains largely invisible. However, many women have stated that they are influenced in their decision about abortion by the man and one of the most frequently stated reasons for terminating a pregnancy is related to the partner (Torres and Darroch Forrest, 1988; Törnbom et al., 1994; Skjeldestad, 1994; Holmgren, 1994; Söderberg et al., 1997; Johansson et al., 1998). "


Laws are for the purpose of maintaining order in society. Criminalizing abortion adds nothing to order in society, therefore there is no reason for anti-abortion laws.



So men want women to be required to give birth because that evens out the responsibility? Many men want women to abort, and in fact, one state is considering legislation to require doctors to be certain that women have not been coerced into the decision to abort. Men don't have financial responsibility for a PREGNANCY, they have financial responsibility for a child. Financial responsibility for the child is shared by the mother. Physical responsibility for the pregnancy belongs to the woman and cannot be shared, which is why the decision for the pregnancy belongs to her. If men are willing to be involved in the decision, most women are willing to listen, but in the end the decision is hers.

But now we are dealing with ifs and maybes. Every one of your sentences is a hypothetical. All abortions are killing. And all coital conception takes 2 people. The individual circumstances may be different, but we aren't dealing with the individual instances. Nor does the law.

Quote:

The male partner involved in legal abortion -- Kero et al. 14 (10): 2669 -- Human Reproduction

And exactly how many is "many"? And what kind of "influence"? Is "related to the partner" a euphemism for there not being one? Vague statements like that are the tale-tell signs of BS flinging.

And I disagree. We have several laws that are variable depending on where you are. Gambling, prostitution, even homosexuality. So when you create laws that are pretty much just based on nothing but opinion, you end up with anything. Abortion is killing. Period. It may be legal killing, and you might not be able to stop it, but that doesn't make it "right". I do not advocate ending abortion. I have said several times that it does serve a public safety purpose. But there should be SOME penalty assessed. "Killing" should not be left up to choice.

I disagree that financial responsibility is "shared". There is no measure of a woman's finances in many states child support laws. If the responsibility is "shared" there would be more equitable determination of the "share" instead of a blanket percentage and women would not be able to return to court if the father earns more income later than he was when they conceived.

Let's say that the law gives the father a 'say'. The first thing he's going to have to do, is prove that he has legal standing. Since the majority of abortions are done well before fetal DNA testing can be done, HOW is he going to prove that he is actually the child's father?

I must say your new avatar is better than what I looked at last week.

Oh poot. Leave my Avatar alone. I figured I'd just go to my balloon based avatars again since everybody complained about my other wonderful pictures. You missed it though, I had a picture of myself posted until a certain member of this forum(guess who) downloaded it and used it on another debate web site. How rude.

LOL