Defending the Truth
Articles | Interviews | Politicians | Groups | Arcade | Experience | Donate
  Defending the Truth > Political Issues > Abortion
responsibility

Abortion How do you feel about abortion? Are you pro-choice or pro-life? Defend your views on abortion in this forum.

Reply
Page 8 of 32 < 1234567 8 910111213141516171819202122 > Last »
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-13-2008, 03:07 PM   #71 (permalink)
SIMPLETON
Premium Member
 
fxashun's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: In my skin
Gender: Male
Posts: 8,907
Country:
Points: 25,586, Level: 96
Points: 25,586, Level: 96 Points: 25,586, Level: 96 Points: 25,586, Level: 96
Level up: 24%, 764 Points needed
Level up: 24% Level up: 24% Level up: 24%
Activity: 26%
Activity: 26% Activity: 26% Activity: 26%
fxashun is offline 		Reply With Quote
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catus Felidae View Post
Apples and oranges fx. If the woman aborts, there is no child to support. Therefore, the mans 'right' and the womans right, are not interchangeable.
No it's not apples and oranges. We are talking about the right to the baby that two people created. We are talking about an embryo here. No fruit anywhere in sight.
Sponsored Links
Old 01-13-2008, 03:11 PM   #72 (permalink)
Council Member
 
Catus Felidae's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2007
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,325
Country:
Points: 6,973, Level: 55
Points: 6,973, Level: 55 Points: 6,973, Level: 55 Points: 6,973, Level: 55
Level up: 12%, 177 Points needed
Level up: 12% Level up: 12% Level up: 12%
Activity: 30%
Activity: 30% Activity: 30% Activity: 30%
Catus Felidae is online now 		Reply With Quote
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fxashun View Post
No it's not apples and oranges. We are talking about the right to the baby that two people created. We are talking about an embryo here. No fruit anywhere in sight.
Don't be silly fx. You know full well what the phrase 'apples and oranges' means.

And you're not talking about a 'right to a baby two people created'. You're talking about a womans right to bodily autonomy and trying to say that it's the same thing as refusing to pay money to support your child.

It would only be the same if the woman could pay someone else to carry the fetus to term.


Bother not the cat. For they are sneaky and will piss on thy keyboard.
Old 01-13-2008, 03:23 PM   #73 (permalink)
SIMPLETON
Premium Member
 
fxashun's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: In my skin
Gender: Male
Posts: 8,907
Country:
Points: 25,586, Level: 96
Points: 25,586, Level: 96 Points: 25,586, Level: 96 Points: 25,586, Level: 96
Level up: 24%, 764 Points needed
Level up: 24% Level up: 24% Level up: 24%
Activity: 26%
Activity: 26% Activity: 26% Activity: 26%
fxashun is offline 		Reply With Quote
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catus Felidae View Post
Don't be silly fx. You know full well what the phrase 'apples and oranges' means.

I sure do. And you would think you would know that the life of an embryo would trump "choice". Who is being more ignorant?

And you're not talking about a 'right to a baby two people created'. You're talking about a womans right to bodily autonomy and trying to say that it's the same thing as refusing to pay money to support your child.

No, I'm saying that if a woman wants to have all the cards in the situation, then she should pay all the costs. If she wants child support, then the man should have had some say in the decision as well. "Choice" should be a two way street if that was really what we were debating here. It seems women have all the "choice". And that's BS.

It would only be the same if the woman could pay someone else to carry the fetus to term.
Or she could do as you suggested earlier and zip her pants and buy a vibrator.
Last edited by fxashun; 01-13-2008 at 03:34 PM.
Old 01-13-2008, 03:31 PM   #74 (permalink)
Account Deleted
Join Date: Dec 2006
Gender: Female
Posts: 3,738
Country:
Points: 16,625, Level: 82
Points: 16,625, Level: 82 Points: 16,625, Level: 82 Points: 16,625, Level: 82
Level up: 55%, 225 Points needed
Level up: 55% Level up: 55% Level up: 55%
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
OhDear is offline 		Reply With Quote
 
Quote:
She's getting counseling for the loss of her child. As for him, she can hardly get out of bed in the morning, and he's telling her 'we can have another child'. Seems to me that he's the one that need some counseling. Only an ass would expect a woman to be thinking about a 'replacement' child at this point.
from Catus.

Catus,

please forgive me, if this seems insensitive. It truly is NOT. But I think that the man is at a loss for words to comfort. Is grasping at straws. And what he is doing, though in a rather clumsy way, is the same thing that you are claiming to do. He is attempting to show that his heart, his priority is with his wife.

I fail to see where his stated "attitude" is any different than what yours would be, given you are so very thoroughly pro-choice, and in that, place the priority on the woman not the fetus.

And I do not say these things without any experience with it all. I have had five live births, two miscarriages. And of my five live births, two of my children are disabled. I have felt the wide range of grief and joy. And I have had to let the well-meaning words shared by others mean that there was an attempt to bring comfort to me, even if the words on their own were clumsy.

It all gets summarized in this very true and wise conclusion, that you actually shared: Some things just "Are" and you can either kick and scream like a little child who wants dessert before dinner, or you can grow the hell up and accept reality.
Life is not always easy, and we can't make the hard stuff go away. Whether we are woman or man...

OhDear
Old 01-13-2008, 03:47 PM   #75 (permalink)
Council Member
 
Catus Felidae's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2007
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,325
Country:
Points: 6,973, Level: 55
Points: 6,973, Level: 55 Points: 6,973, Level: 55 Points: 6,973, Level: 55
Level up: 12%, 177 Points needed
Level up: 12% Level up: 12% Level up: 12%
Activity: 30%
Activity: 30% Activity: 30% Activity: 30%
Catus Felidae is online now 		Reply With Quote
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhDear View Post
from Catus.

Catus,

please forgive me, if this seems insensitive. It truly is NOT. But I think that the man is at a loss for words to comfort. Is grasping at straws. And what he is doing, though in a rather clumsy way, is the same thing that you are claiming to do. He is attempting to show that his heart, his priority is with his wife.


I don't think so. It seems to me that if that were true, when his words failed to comfort, he would not repeat them. Perhaps he is in so much pain that he would rather pretend that the entire pregnancy and loss never happened. But if that is true, then his attitude is causing his wife more pain. If he is actually at a loss for words, then he needs to shut up and just hold her hand.


I fail to see where his stated "attitude" is any different than what yours would be, given you are so very thoroughly pro-choice, and in that, place the priority on the woman not the fetus.

I place the priority wherever the pregnant woman wants it to be. This does not mean that I can't understand the grief a woman who loses a full term infant goes through. I would never expect her to treat it like it was no big deal because 'she can have another one'. I wouldn't do that to someone who lost a pet.

And I do not say these things without any experience with it all. I have had five live births, two miscarriages. And of my five live births, two of my children are disabled. I have felt the wide range of grief and joy. And I have had to let the well-meaning words shared by others mean that there was an attempt to bring comfort to me, even if the words on their own were clumsy.

Three miscarriages and two live births for me. I too had people be insensitive. But my husband, even though his sense of loss was less than mine, was never dismissive of my feelings or impatient with my emotional recovery.

It all gets summarized in this very true and wise conclusion, that you actually shared: Some things just "Are" and you can either kick and scream like a little child who wants dessert before dinner, or you can grow the hell up and accept reality.
Life is not always easy, and we can't make the hard stuff go away. Whether we are woman or man...

OhDear
I've always said..."Don't sweat the small stuff. There may be bigger stuff coming.".
Bother not the cat. For they are sneaky and will piss on thy keyboard.
Old 01-13-2008, 03:59 PM   #76 (permalink)
Council Member
 
baloney_detector's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2007
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,224
Country:
Points: 6,683, Level: 53
Points: 6,683, Level: 53 Points: 6,683, Level: 53 Points: 6,683, Level: 53
Level up: 67%, 67 Points needed
Level up: 67% Level up: 67% Level up: 67%
Activity: 10%
Activity: 10% Activity: 10% Activity: 10%
baloney_detector is offline 		Reply With Quote
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fxashun View Post
No, I'm saying that if a woman wants to have all the cards in the situation, then she should pay all the costs. If she wants child support, then the man should have had some say in the decision as well. "Choice" should be a two way street if that was really what we were debating here. It seems women have all the "choice". And that's BS.
For someone who tends to scream out what is natural or not, you appear to choose to be completely ignorant of the fact that men and women have different "natural" situations.

And your conclusion (above) might mean something if both the woman and the man played an equal set of roles regarding reproduction.

But they don't play an equal set of roles regarding reproduction.

And, therefore, there will always be an unequal set of rights for men and women relating to reproduction...regardless if you accept this fact or not.
Old 01-13-2008, 04:00 PM   #77 (permalink)
Council Member
 
Catus Felidae's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2007
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,325
Country:
Points: 6,973, Level: 55
Points: 6,973, Level: 55 Points: 6,973, Level: 55 Points: 6,973, Level: 55
Level up: 12%, 177 Points needed
Level up: 12% Level up: 12% Level up: 12%
Activity: 30%
Activity: 30% Activity: 30% Activity: 30%
Catus Felidae is online now 		Reply With Quote
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fxashun View Post
Or she could do as you suggested earlier and zip her pants and buy a vibrator.
She could, but she doesn't have to in order to be in control of what happens. The same can't be said for the man.


Bother not the cat. For they are sneaky and will piss on thy keyboard.
Old 01-13-2008, 04:04 PM   #78 (permalink)
Council Member
 
Catus Felidae's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2007
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,325
Country:
Points: 6,973, Level: 55
Points: 6,973, Level: 55 Points: 6,973, Level: 55 Points: 6,973, Level: 55
Level up: 12%, 177 Points needed
Level up: 12% Level up: 12% Level up: 12%
Activity: 30%
Activity: 30% Activity: 30% Activity: 30%
Catus Felidae is online now 		Reply With Quote
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fxashun View Post
I sure do. And you would think you would know that the life of an embryo would trump "choice". Who is being more ignorant?

The life of an embryo doesn't trump 'choice' for a woman who aborts. It doesn't trump choice as far as the law is concerned. I would have to say that you are being more ignorant.


No, I'm saying that if a woman wants to have all the cards in the situation, then she should pay all the costs. If she wants child support, then the man should have had some say in the decision as well. "Choice" should be a two way street if that was really what we were debating here. It seems women have all the "choice". And that's BS.
She doesn't have all the cards because she 'wants' to. She has all the cards because that's the way the 'nature' you're so fond of referencing, says so.

The man had his 'choice'. The choice of whether or not to have sex and place any further decisions solely in the womans hands.

It's not BS fx. It's reality.
Bother not the cat. For they are sneaky and will piss on thy keyboard.
Old 01-13-2008, 04:05 PM   #79 (permalink)
Council Member
 
Catus Felidae's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2007
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,325
Country:
Points: 6,973, Level: 55
Points: 6,973, Level: 55 Points: 6,973, Level: 55 Points: 6,973, Level: 55
Level up: 12%, 177 Points needed
Level up: 12% Level up: 12% Level up: 12%
Activity: 30%
Activity: 30% Activity: 30% Activity: 30%
Catus Felidae is online now 		Reply With Quote
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by baloney_detector View Post
For someone who tends to scream out what is natural or not, you appear to choose to be completely ignorant of the fact that men and women have different "natural" situations.
He does seem to like to play the 'natural card' when it suits him, and totally ignore it when it doesn't.


Bother not the cat. For they are sneaky and will piss on thy keyboard.
Old 01-13-2008, 04:21 PM   #80 (permalink)
Council Member
 
baloney_detector's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2007
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,224
Country:
Points: 6,683, Level: 53
Points: 6,683, Level: 53 Points: 6,683, Level: 53 Points: 6,683, Level: 53
Level up: 67%, 67 Points needed
Level up: 67% Level up: 67% Level up: 67%
Activity: 10%
Activity: 10% Activity: 10% Activity: 10%
baloney_detector is offline 		Reply With Quote
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catus Felidae View Post
He does seem to like to play the 'natural card' when it suits him, and totally ignore it when it doesn't.
Yeah, that's what it seems like.

And, if you ask me, his "if it's natural, it must be right" conclusions are simply nonsense.
Reply
Page 8 of 32 < 1234567 8 910111213141516171819202122 > Last »

Bookmarks

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Thread Tools
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:16 PM.

Defending the Truth - FAQ - Rules - Contact Us - Donate - Archive - Top

 Top Political Sites
Poltical Topsites 

Recommended Sites