Grace originally claimed:
I never said that I could prove Grace wrong. I don't believe it is possible just as I don' believe it is possible for Grace to prove her opinion is correct.

Let me give an example that most of you will understand that shows why Grace cannot prove her point.

Let us say that she comes up with a list of Christian charities and a list of secular and non-Christian religious charities worldwide. Included on that list would be The Salvation Army and also (I hope) a Birmingham, Alabama shelter called Jimmy Hale Mission/ Jesse's Place.

I am agnostic. Over the years I have made many donations to The Salvation Army. And every year at the holidays I send a couple of checks to Jimmy Hale Mission to help provide Thanksgiving and Christmas dinners for homeless people and abuse victims.

So, in counting the efforts of these two charities, the monies that I have donated would be counted toward "Christian charities."

But I am not a Christian. So counting those monies as "Christians stepping up to the plate" would be erroneous. And how many more non-believers like me give money to Christian charities when they know that the money will be used for the purpose of providing for the worldly needs of people in need? My guess is that such action is very common.

By the same token is would be impossible to separate out money given by Christians to secular charities.

So any figures that anyone produces to show that Christians "step up to the plate" more or less than others would be meaningless.
Whatever you say Skippy Lou. Resist replying to this. I dare you.

BINGO!

I know that I myself have donated money, food, clothing, toys, furniture, and other items to several charities quite frequently...As well as I also know many non-Christians that do so as well besides just Athiest/Agnostics.

As far as charities go...It's pretty much even in who donates of being non-Christian and Christian alike. So to say that the funds raised is 'Christians stepping up to the plate' is really deceptive and non-proveable either way who gives most or most often. LOL!

Grace, you make statements that you claim are factual, and then when someone challenges you to provide statistical or empirical evidence to support those statements, you just dismiss them or disregard them entirely. Here's one for you. Despite all the so called believers in the Christ, can you prove that he ever, in fact, existed? Historians have attempted to prove the existence of Jesus of Nazareth and have been unable to do so. So how do you, outside of the basic foundation of "faith" prove this man/god ever even lived?

Germans of today cannot endorse the actions of the Nazi's without facing stiff legal and social penalties. Yet what can they do about something that happened in the last century? I point to Christian Holocausts of the centuries past and you take the position that you hold no responsibility despite your fanatical support of the organizations that promulgated such acts. You use the same arguments of faith that they did to rape, murder and pillage - but you don't see how you are connected? You condemn women who've had abortions to hell, but you don't see how that's the same logic claimed by the perpetrators of the Christian Holocausts? How do you explain yourself?

Im I a German? No Im not. I am a American, I wasnt responible for the cursades, nor will I take any responcibility. Nor do I know anyone who was responcible. I AM NOT CONNECTED. No matter how hard to try to make me be. Are you responcible for what your people (who ever they may be) for what happened 1000 years ago??? IM NOT EVEN CATHOLIC. LOL

Besides, the Catholics may have went to far in the cursades, but its not like their cause wasnt to stop the muslims from slaughtering thousands of Christians and Jews, taking there homes, Property and lives, and forcing conversion. You act like they just took it apon themselfs to just start killing people for no reason.

Why do you give to Christian charities???? Cause you know they are the people who deal with such things. You have proven your self more wrong with this post than you have proven yourself right.

Havent been reading up on the resent digs in Israel hu?

Wrong, very wrong. They never forced conversion on those living under Arab rule. They allowed pilgrims from all faiths to come to Jerusalem to visit their holy places, without any repercussions. The crusades were done to reclaim the holy land back from Arab or Ottoman rule, because the church wanted to control it. Check your facts Grace. It was Isabella and Ferdinand who expelled all non-Catholics from Spain including Moslems and Jews, if they did not convert. It was Christians who did that, not Arabs.

I would think Grace, that any form of charity is Christian, isn't it? Regardless of the name of the charitable organization. And I think we were discussing the abuse that has occurred in some of those charitable Christian organizations, by the very people supposedly caring for their charitable subject's souls. Can you think of a more horrible thing than soul killing?

I worked for a very large Christian charitable organization with my mother when I was a kid. And I'll tell you one thing, the actual works of charity that were done, were done by those previously helped, or those being helped by that charity. Not the leaders. The leaders took the credit, and did none of the actual work. They used us and exploited us, and tossed us to the side when our usefulness ran out. When my mother died from an overdose when I was 16, I never even received a card or a phone call from any of them. Prior to her fall from grace, I was constantly lifted up at their events and even hosted and MC'd events. My mother was never paid a wage for her work, she was "taken care of" by the wealthy leaders. When she died, I could not even collect social security because she hadn't earned wages enough, even though she worked for them for 10 years. And that was no little charity, it was the Foundation. Look them up, and you'll see the political influence that they wield. It's frightful really what is done sometimes in the name of charity.