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Abortion How do you feel about abortion? Are you pro-choice or pro-life? Defend your views on abortion in this forum.

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Old 03-08-2007, 10:22 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jefferson View Post
Roe vs Wade will likely be overturned by an increasingly conservative Supreme Court.

Then it will be illegal.

Then what kind of stupid excuses are you going to make?
highly UNlikely
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Old 03-08-2007, 10:29 AM   #32 (permalink)
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My memory of it is vague. But it seems to me legal scholars have observed that in the event Roe v. Wade were overturned; that one reversal would NOT render abortion illegal throughout the U.S.
Instead, according to my memory of that article (read perhaps years ago) it would simply send the dispute back to the States.
There, it seems some States would outlaw it. Others might not.
In that case, the "blue" States would probably benefit economically from the "red" State hypocrites; seeking legal, safe OB/GYN procedures unavailable in "red" States.
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Old 03-08-2007, 10:57 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jefferson View Post
Roe vs Wade will likely be overturned by an increasingly conservative Supreme Court.
And EXACTLY how many previous US Supreme Court decisions have been "overturned" by the US Supreme Court in the past?

(The US Supreme Court simply isn't going to overturn it's own decision, no matter which justices are sitting at the bench. It just ISN'T going to happen.)
Old 03-08-2007, 02:04 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Quote:
"And EXACTLY how many previous US Supreme Court decisions have been "overturned" by the US Supreme Court in the past?" bd
Quote:
"The Supreme Court has reversed itself many times."

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I'm not so sure about the next one.
But this is what ask.com says:
Quote:
The Masonic Lodge and the Christian Conscience
The United States Supreme Court has reversed itself no less than 200 times in its history.

404 Error Message - equip.org
That's almost once per year.
I'm skeptical about that. But settle it with the Masons.
Quote:
"(The US Supreme Court simply isn't going to overturn it's own decision, no matter which justices are sitting at the bench. It just ISN'T going to happen.)" bd
Many legal scholars seem to think, whether or not the result of Roe v. Wade is right, the legal process by which it was decided was flawed.

Possibly so.
But apart from stare decisis, there's a tradition in the U.S. that law with this many decades of tenure be treated as "settled law".
There are exceptions. But generally the doctrine of "settled law" applies.

C.J. Robers is said to be a conservative.
We may soon find out whether he's a social conservative (& overturn Roe v. Wade), or a legal conservative and let it stand.
Quote:
In a 6:3 ruling in Jan. '06 the U.S. Supreme Court affirmed Oregon's Death With Dignity Law. The (ostensibly) conservative Thomas, Scalia, & Chief Justice Roberts provided the minority votes in the 6:3 ruling.
Commenting on this, George Will said:

"The good news as conservatives see it is they wanted someone who would be like Thomas and Scalia, and they got one. ...
The bad news is that uh the conservative values of federalism, that is, respect the democratic judgment of Oregon to have a different approach. It's the only State in the union with now a physician assisted suicide law; respect that and construe the law narrowly.
What the 6 [ostensibly liberal] justices said was, we read the Controlled Substances Act. Nothing in the text or the legislative history says that the Congress intended to intrude the federal government into what has traditionally been a State prerogative, the control of medicine. And therefore conservative values won out, without the 3 most conservative justices."
George Will
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Old 03-08-2007, 02:25 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billybobama View Post
To me Abortion is an argument for idiots. Half the population cannot even have an Abortion. Though I did have a Republican male tell me he could have an Abortion. Abortion is a gender issue; let the females work it out. Men just need to butt out.
I don't think I really buy into this. I certainly see where you are coming from, but it is an ethical issue, and ethics are gender neutral. It becomes a male issue for many reasons. Men are still required in order to conceive a child, so depending on the relationship with the mother, they may warrant some say, and in many cases it may be a male doctor who either has to perform the abortion, or present it as an option. Furthermore, I don't think anyone would argue that it becomes an issue where a man has input in the case where the mother's life is in jeopardy. I for one know that if the woman who I love were going to die in birth, I'd want her to have an abortion.
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Old 03-08-2007, 03:03 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sear View Post
"The Supreme Court has reversed itself many times."
Oh, I'd just like to see the exact cases whereby the US Supreme Court essentially throw out an earlier US Supreme Court ruling...none of which these citations provide.

And we aren't taking about lower court rulings being thrown out by the US Supreme Court either, right?

(I could be wrong, but I don't recall hearing the highest court in the land ever, essentially and officially, "correcting itself.")
Old 03-08-2007, 03:07 PM   #37 (permalink)
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I don't know of 200 of them - I know they reversed their own ruling on whether it was cruel and unusual punishment to impose a death penalty on a crime committed by somebody under 18.
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Conservatism: Self-centered mean-spiritedness fueled by ignorance and misguided self-importance.

Bigotry is a social disease.

Legalized same-sex marriage almost certainly benefits those same-sex couples who choose to marry, as well as the children being raised in those homes. - David Blankenhorn is president of the New York-based Institute for American Values and the author of "The Future of Marriage."
Old 03-08-2007, 03:41 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Quote:
"(I could be wrong, but I don't recall hearing the highest court in the land ever, essentially and officially, "correcting itself.")" bd
Good question.
That would not meet my definition of of reversing "itself".

I recall a case related to the U.S. Pledge of Allegiance.
Even before a Presidential Decree and an act of Congress added the words "under god" to it, I believe a religious group, Jehovah's Witnesses perhaps, submitted objection about it. I believe the ruling was reversed in fairly short order, a few years, if I recall correctly.

But bd, you seem to be surprised that SCOTUS has this power.
I agree, due to the doctrine of "finality" (& or related ...) SCOTUS rulings should be final.
BUT !!!
They should be decided wisely in the first place.
They are not always.
Their own authority to reverse their earlier ruling is one of the remedies for that.
Quote:
The Supreme Court rules 9 to 0 May 17 in Brown v. Board of Education that racial segregation in public schools is unconstitutional. The court overturns the "separate but equal" doctrine laid down in the 1896 case Plessy v. Ferguson

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Old 03-08-2007, 07:19 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baloney_detector View Post
And EXACTLY how many previous US Supreme Court decisions have been "overturned" by the US Supreme Court in the past?

(The US Supreme Court simply isn't going to overturn it's own decision, no matter which justices are sitting at the bench. It just ISN'T going to happen.)
Oh ye of little historical insight.

Plessy v Ferguesson 1897 established the basis of separate but equal. Brown v Board of Education 1954 overturned the decision.

The misguided myth that because Roe v Wade is a well established rule of law is just that a myth. Roe decided in 1973 is only 34 years old, Plessy was 57 when it was finally overturned. Furthermore, the basic premise of Roe remains, that under liberty a woman has the right to choose, however, Roe also established the three trimester clarification which stated that in the first trimester the decision was between the mother and doctor and the government should have no interferrence, in the second trimester the government was allowed to restrict certain procedures and in the third trimester the government had to weigh the potential life of the fetus and could restrict the availability of abortions or only allow abortions to save the life or maternal health. In 1989, Webster v Reproductive Health Services for the most part scrapped the trimester theory established in Roe and replaced it with viability following 20 weeks. Interestingly enough, Webster also upheld the establish of life at conception.

So it would seem that there is a possibility that the Court could overturn Roe v Wade, which would return the decision to the states and the people where it belongs.

dmk
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-Russell Kirk-
Old 03-08-2007, 07:22 PM   #40 (permalink)
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issues of civil rights should NEVER be left "to the people"

that is the reason we are a constiutional democratic republic

we don't put the rights of others up to public vote
*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

Conservatism: Self-centered mean-spiritedness fueled by ignorance and misguided self-importance.

Bigotry is a social disease.

Legalized same-sex marriage almost certainly benefits those same-sex couples who choose to marry, as well as the children being raised in those homes. - David Blankenhorn is president of the New York-based Institute for American Values and the author of "The Future of Marriage."
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