What to do when one race has all the problems?

Olifant · 05-19-2007, 12:20 AM

How does someone address an issue when one race has all the problems without being targeted as a racist? For instance, africa, the blacks need some controls and discipline which they lack as their various tribes and nations and what states manage to stand-up. Obviously it's not a racial thing but a stage of economic development that is collapsing due to over-population. But how does one address this when everyone else who could suggest anything are so full of their righteous selves they can't possibly think that it's a problem in the black community?

vharlow · 05-19-2007, 12:35 AM

You know, Oli, it just might sound more palatable if it was the blacks of Africa themselves looking for answers.

Ultimately, that is the only way they will pull themselves out of it in any event. It has been suggested by scholars that it would be best to leave them alone to do just that. It's a struggle most of the more progressive cultures already lived through.

Birth control is not something you can choose for a totally different cultural group without sounding like a monster.

Find ways to influence them if you really believe this is a just cause that will help them.

I think economic development needs to come first, as better living usually lowers birth rates all by itself.

Olifant · 05-19-2007, 12:38 AM

We here all have a stake in this issue there's a reason Cape Town went from the Paris of Africa to the rape capital of the world. I disagree on your other points the governments of India and China force sterilization and rightfully so. If their economies aren't growing faster then their populations then they'd be ruined.

That's not the question here though...

tadpole256 · 05-19-2007, 12:51 AM

You'd place the value of an economy over the value of human rights? Apalling...

Antithesis · 05-19-2007, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olifant

We here all have a stake in this issue there's a reason Cape Town went from the Paris of Africa to the rape capital of the world. I disagree on your other points the governments of India and China force sterilization and rightfully so. If their economies aren't growing faster then their populations then they'd be ruined.

That's not the question here though...

I assume you support pop control in China and India because they're sterilizing Asians and Indians.

Olifant · 05-20-2007, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tadpole256

You'd place the value of an economy over the value of human rights? Apalling...

It is inhumane to have people living in filth, squalor, disease, and war, because there are too many of them.

Sorry but it is...you cannot justify your humanity unless you are willing to take 400-500 million black africans into the United States.

But if you did you'd be much more poor yourselves.

vharlow · 05-20-2007, 12:19 PM

So, Oli, are you saying that to forcibly sterile the entire black population is something you would do in order to help them?

If so, you would need influential members of that population to come forth and make this proposition so they would willingly do this to help themselves.

Talking to the US about it is a total waste of time, and as you can see, we aren't exactly going to cheer a white proposing to take the rights of a black away as naturally, there would follow the suspicion that you only want to help yourself.

CrazyFlamingos · 05-20-2007, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vharlow

So, Oli, are you saying that to forcibly sterile the entire black population is something you would do in order to help them?

If so, you would need influential members of that population to come forth and make this proposition so they would willingly do this to help themselves.

Talking to the US about it is a total waste of time, and as you can see, we aren't exactly going to cheer a white proposing to take the rights of a black away as naturally, there would follow the suspicion that you only want to help yourself.

I think you have a good point.

Why is Oli advocating sterilizing only the black population?

Why not all South African citizens?

It takes the same amount of resources to provide for any child & educate them to become productive citizens whether that child is black or white.

Antithesis · 05-20-2007, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olifant

It is inhumane to have people living in filth, squalor, disease, and war, because there are too many of them.

Sorry but it is...you cannot justify your humanity unless you are willing to take 400-500 million black africans into the United States.

But if you did you'd be much more poor yourselves.

Underneath your utilitarian logic lies something we can NEVER legislate, which is the idea that a race is unclean and needs to be controlled.

Are you familiar with Thomas Malthus, an economist who posed the hypothesis that as population grows out of control the only limiters will be war, hunger, natural disasters, and disease? Are you aware your ideas bear a striking resemblance to his, and that they have been disproven time and time again? In industrialized countries we have the population problem under control, and we are able to feed hundreds upon millions. Even nations like Japan, which has almost no domestic resources yet a huge population, are capable of adequately taking care of its citizens.

Your pushing a failed, archaic economic premonition that has only come to fruition in South Africa because of extraordinary circumstances. Europeans destroyed the continent. Europeans left it in economic ruin. Europeans left a culture where blacks were second class citizens. Now you say that the only thing to do is to do what the 19th century Europeans would term "finishing the job?" HA!!!

vharlow · 05-20-2007, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyFlamingos

I think you have a good point.

Why is Oli advocating sterilizing only the black population?

Why not all South African citizens?

It takes the same amount of resources to provide for any child & educate them to become productive citizens whether that child is black or white.

Well, Ali, I think that whites of European origin all over the world are already practicing birth control to the point of not even reproducing at replacement rate, and it's a big problem for them. Their lovely social programs are not sustainable partly because of their reluctance to reproduce.