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| Gay Marriage Debate and defend your political beliefs as to whether or not marriage should be only defined as a union between a man and a woman. |
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| Council Member ![]() Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Chicago 'burbs Gender: ![]() Posts: 1,594 Country: ![]()
| I'm just going to let this article stand for itself... I'll join in if it touches off a discussion. ===================== Civil unions between male couples existed around 600 years ago in medieval Europe, a historian now says. Historical evidence, including legal documents and gravesites, can be interpreted as supporting the prevalence of homosexual relationships hundreds of years ago, said Allan Tulchin of Shippensburg University in Pennsylvania. If accurate, the results indicate socially sanctioned same-sex unions are nothing new, nor were they taboo in the past. “Western family structures have been much more varied than many people today seem to realize," Tulchin writes in the September issue of the Journal of Modern History. "And Western legal systems have in the past made provisions for a variety of household structures.” For example, he found legal contracts from late medieval France that referred to the term "affrèrement," roughly translated as brotherment. Similar contracts existed elsewhere in Mediterranean Europe, Tulchin said. In the contract, the "brothers" pledged to live together sharing "un pain, un vin, et une bourse," (that's French for one bread, one wine and one purse). The "one purse" referred to the idea that all of the couple's goods became joint property. Like marriage contracts, the "brotherments" had to be sworn before a notary and witnesses, Tulchin explained. The same type of legal contract of the time also could provide the foundation for a variety of non-nuclear households, including arrangements in which two or more biological brothers inherited the family home from their parents and would continue to live together, Tulchin said. But non-relatives also used the contracts. In cases that involved single, unrelated men, Tulchin argues, these contracts provide “considerable evidence that the affrèrés were using affrèrements to formalize same-sex loving relationships." The ins-and-outs of the medieval relationships are tricky at best to figure out. "I suspect that some of these relationships were sexual, while others may not have been," Tulchin said. "It is impossible to prove either way and probably also somewhat irrelevant to understanding their way of thinking. They loved each other, and the community accepted that.” Gay Unions Sanctioned in Medieval Europe - Yahoo! News | |||||||||||||||||||||
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| | #2 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Banned ![]() Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Los Angeles Gender: ![]() Posts: 11,893 Country: ![]()
| Use of the Rack Sanctioned in Medieval Europe Quote: There were no laws or rules to protect the treatment of prisoners who faced torture, such as the Rack by Stretching and Dislocation. Torture was seen as a totally legitimate means for justice to extract confessions, obtain the names of accomplices, obtain testimonies or confessions. The Rack Torture I don't think we want to turn back the clock. Isn't change a good thing? | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| | #3 (permalink) | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Senator ![]() Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Illinois Gender: ![]() Posts: 3,768 Country: ![]()
| CHRISTIANGAYS.COM: When Marriage Between Gays Was a Rite | |||||||||||||||||||||
| | #4 (permalink) | |||||||||||||||||||||
| *Premium Member* Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New Haven, CT Gender: ![]() Posts: 8,764 Country: ![]()
| and, yet, there are so many people who talk about the way "things have always been" seems it only is so when it supports their opinions *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Conservatism: Self-centered mean-spiritedness fueled by ignorance and misguided self-importance. Bigotry is a social disease. Legalized same-sex marriage almost certainly benefits those same-sex couples who choose to marry, as well as the children being raised in those homes. - David Blankenhorn is president of the New York-based Institute for American Values and the author of "The Future of Marriage." | |||||||||||||||||||||
| | #5 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Senator ![]() Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Illinois Gender: ![]() Posts: 3,768 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
It's called progression and growth of society. And if it didn't change over time, we'd still be living in caves and drawing on the walls of those caves. Half the problem is, that those saying that 'it's always been like this/that' is the simple fact they're scared of change. Especially any type of change they feel will mess with what they feel they are only entitled in having, or those that share their limited and in-the-box perceptions of how they want things to be. | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| | #6 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Council Member ![]() Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Chicago 'burbs Gender: ![]() Posts: 1,594 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
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| | #7 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Moderator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: San Diego, CA Gender: ![]() Posts: 5,697 Country: ![]()
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Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path. Psalm 119:105 | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| | #8 (permalink) | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Senator ![]() Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Illinois Gender: ![]() Posts: 3,768 Country: ![]()
| Hey, that's one link I've made sure I never lose...It comes in so handy, don't you think? ROTFLMAOL!!! | |||||||||||||||||||||
| | #9 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Block Captain ![]() Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 369 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
And to this day 2 men can create a contract between each other that allows them to split property and so forth. But its not marriage either. Don't get me wrong I think gay people should be able to get divorced just like everyone else which is what marriage really leads to but all this article means is that we need to update our concepts of contract if they haven't changed since medievil times. | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| | #10 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Banned ![]() Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Los Angeles Gender: ![]() Posts: 11,893 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
Would you welcome that? Surely you aren't scared of change? The reality is nobody really wants change for the sake of change. They use fear of change as a bogus argument for changing to something THEY happen to prefer. | ||||||||||||||||||||||
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