Defending the Truth

Hey all you creationists out there, you argue that creationism has scientific merit and should be taught along side the theory of evolution in schools, correct? You say that we should teach both theories and allow kids to choose between the two. What about the thousands of other creation stories? Almost every religion has their own. Do they have scientific merit? Why don't we teach them? If we say ok, we are allowing the Christian creation story but not the stories for other religions, wouldn't that be promoting a singular religion and therefore go against the principles of church and state? Your argument to teach both would have much more merit if you did not exclude other versions of the story. By trying to teach one creation story as fact and excluding others, you are merely setting yourselves up for failure under the principles of church and state.

Boomboy makes a good point.

If schools were to teach creationism, then what creationist myth should be taught. Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Aboriginal, Oriental???

Apart from the obvious difficulty in choosing which particular myth to teach, i have another major concern.

I see no harm in airing and discussing the theory that human creation is a result of some basic intelligence that pushes evolution/creation in a particular direction. However i have a big problem with the moral, divine and theological absolutes that invariably follow creationism.

If a curriculum could discuss evolution as a result of creative intelligence, then we actually have a valid debate going on. The observable science of evolution would be put in context of a greater philosophical question. I think children would benefit from that.

However to present a choice to children that says " either we evolved from a primordial soup OR God made little figurines and breathed life into them".. well that does not teach them ANYTHING. In fact it is rather confusing, because you are presenting two choices that cannot be compared.

Saying that the human genome has evolved from XYZ is one thing.. Saying that GOd created us without actually explaining the science or the mechanics of that creation is at best indoctrination, and at worst plain stupid.

My point is that creationism does explain the question asked.. the question that evolution answers is HOW mankind came about.. creationism doesn't do that in any other way than saying God did magic and man was made. The former gives some sort of hypothesis ( with associated scientific facts), the latter just states a completely unverifiable belief.

Obviously this was directed at me. The answer, no. Never did I say creationism should be taught in school. Its more that I want schools to admit that they could be totally off on what they do teach, and show the evidence as such. I want them to let down the dogma of evolution and stop teaching it as if it were absolute fact. (at the least the parts that are not absolute fact)

I wouldnt be against taking 20 mins outta the whole year and showing that many (including many scientist) feel that everything around us is far to complex to be just from random chance, and talk about other possibilites. I just want true science to be taught, without the fear of finding something you didnt want to see. Then making it fit into a shape that it isnt to support there theories. Cause the truth is, there isnt a missing link, there is a single link, missing a entire chain.

Yeah, let's teach our kids that the earth is only 4000 years old and the dinosaur fossils were put there by God as a test of our faith. Great idea.

Well Grace, the point is that the ONLY thing in evolution that is unsubstantiated "fact" is that it all happens by chance.

Personally i believe that the universe does possess a basic intelligence which led to mankind evolving to its present state.

However whether it happens by chance or by a series of complex and deliberate natural steps is really irrelevant. Kids are being taught about the PROCESSES of evolution.. they are not told WHO does it or WHY it happens.

The WHO and WHY discussion belong to a philosophy class. It has no place being taught alongside evolution, simply because the two cannot be compared and juxtaposed.

Yea, cause thats even close to what I said. You guys are getting boring.

I beg to differ. And so do hundreds of scientists around the world.
I beg to differ once again. There isnt anything basic about the intelligence that transformed this earth into the extremly complex balance that it is.
Yes, they are being told lies, and half truths about the "process of evolution" That is where the problem is.
Such things are not discussed in ANY class, in high school. Besides, there is tons of fossil evidence that fully formed creatures appeared on the earth at one time, admitted by scientists, without a single transitionairy fossil in between. Never mind the total crap they teach as origin of life.

Only if you agree that we also teach Pastafarianism... you know.. the Church of the Flying Spagetti Monster.

Well not really.. like i said, the dissent that exists is as to whether or not evolution occurs as a result of chance or as a result of guidance by an inteligent entity with a preconcieved plan.

While the missing link may not have been found, fossils of primate evolution from australopithecus to homo erectus have been discovered. Likewise the human genome has clear indicators of a common past with other primates ( we are after all 98% genetically alike). Evolution as a natural process is not denied by scientists. However they may deny the unsubstantiated claim that it is all a result of pure chance.
Well by "basic" i do not mean of a lesser order. What i mean is that this intelligence is incorporated into the fabric of the universe. It is a cornerstone of universal development. Everything from cosmic super events to the instincts of a worker ant in the amazon are guided by this intelligence. It is not a separate entitity from the universe ( which is how Divine Intelligence is usually perceived) but rather integrated into everything.
Well i'm not entirely sure you know what you speak of here. Fact is that for want of a better alternative evolution IS the best researched, best documented and most likely process by which we came to be. The fact that we have not found the missing link does not mean that evidence doesn't indicate it is there. For instance in the world of astrophysics, black holes have never been observed, yet we believe they are there based on the evidence before us.

In any case the "hypothesis" of evolution is verifiable to a FAR GREATER degree than any theological creationist mythology. I'm not saying that creationists LIE, but rather their creationist hypothesis only makes any sort of sense in the context of blind faith.. now if creationism requires blind faith to mean anything, is it really something that ought to be taught in schools?

It should be taught in religious studies class, and even then only as a case study on what SOME people believe.
Well i would havce liked to see this stellar evidence that seems to blow a hole through all darwinian theory. NOTHING ont his planet has ever appeared out of the blue. While we may not be able to document the processes that have led to everything on this planet, it is an obervable and verifiable fact that everything appears as a result of other factors.

Humans have evolved from the Planet earth.. soil became amino acids, acids combined to form proteins, proteins combined to form single celled and multi celled organisms, these combinedto form more complex beings, and this process continued for billions of years, until eventually it reached a pinnacle which was when a particular species ( born of the earth) became sentient. That was the start of humanity.. Adam and Eve if you will call it that.. I have always considered Adam and Eve's eviction from paradise to be a metaphor for how they lived in the blissful ignorance of animals and when they became sentient they were evicted from that blissful ignorance. The " tree of knowledge" and all that .

What does the Koran teach about Creation?