waitingtables

And again, for those that are a little slow, I have no problem comprehending things that make sense. It's not my fault that you can't stick to a point and like to try to confuse the issues. I comprehend more than you think.

fxashun

Naaw you just think you comprehend.

__________________
Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense.
Buddha

ABO4MA

Move your conversations to PMs!

Half of this damn thread is just you two going back and forth about nothing. I created this thread to talk about ADDICTION, not to read your insults and disagreements between each other.

fxashun

Oh, my bad. Back to the other off topic stuff.

__________________
Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense.
Buddha

waitingtables

Sorry about that. When I'm insulted, I fight back, but you're right.

hot dragon

addiction is a fascinating and complicated thing. when an opioid addict is denied their opioid they enter a predictable and consistent withdrawal syndrome. you need to have been using reasonably high doses for an extended period, and when it stops, abdominal cramps, diarrhoea, gooseflesh, runny nose, muscle cramps, tremor, for probably 4-5 days.

but if a patient is taking the same doses of the same opioid for the same period of time to treat pain, and you find another way of stopping the pain,you can stop the opioid without any withdrawal.

and if an addict is in opioid withdrawal and they are given placebo, the withdrawal settles.

so opioid withdrawal appears to be psychological.

but it is predictable, consistent accross all patients and even all cultures. there are demonstrated neurological and neurochemical changes in addiction and in withdrawal. this doesnt make sense for a psychological condition, it must be physiological too.

makes for interesting work. and very rewarding. when you can do something to turn around an addiction, the changes are huge, for many people

BlackMinuteMan

Now you can take this any damn way you want to, but white people like you seem
to know everything, and really don't know the pain if you haven't experienced it.
Most people I know seem to always go by what they read at the library, or seen
on 20/20.

Its called for IF I feel that its called for, don't you do whatever you seem to think
is right? and whenever I use the term Whites it does not mean that I am being a
racists. However, as a man who believes in giving respect I shall use the term
people of the other race or skin-color.

Waiting, You spoke about being insulted, but how many times have you insulted
someone? I was not trying to insult anyone on this machine, but if needed I will
do it in reality, and even then I don't call it insulting I call it correcting.
To P/N yawn all you want to that's your business, but it shows me that you are
one of them type posters who know everything but don't know s***.

To me this topic is a very interesting topic, due to the fact that hopefully something
will be read to help to turn someone's or save someone's life. Hot Dragon, I printed
out your post because it make alots of senses, and that was a very good well
explained post.

However Hot Dragon, people who have never experienced being addicted to drugs or
alcohol, but co-dependent do not understand that even at that point they are contributing
to that person's addiction, and to really understand that being addicted to anything is
a disease. HD, in closing after 37 years of having the disease of addiction I can talk about
it, and as a drug counselor with experience I know the reactions and the withdrawl pain.

waitingtables

Are you bi-polar? I ask because you posted back in response to that already in a totally different way. What happened, you suddenly get pissed off about it now? I really don't understand you swings from one thing to the other. You don't know me and you can't say anything about what I know or don't know. I can tell you this, I know enough to know when someone has some kind of problem making sense when they write. Your anger is irrational and misplaced, and clouds your judgement. I've never insulted your race or anyone else's.

Sharon den Adel

I have always thought that addiction was a choice.

There may be something in your brain that makes you crave something, but in the end, you have a choice. IMO people smoke because they choose to, and addiction is simply an excuse they use - like feel sorry for me, I have an addiction.

I don't buy it.

hot dragon

thank you very much.

i hope you have had the right kind of support and help and i hope you are now in control of your life yourself rather than allowing your addiction to control you. and i suspect you have seen the same kind of dramatic changes i have (i also suspect you have seen the same kind of tragedies)

certainly it often happens that others who "support" a person with an addiction end up supporting the addiction more than the person.

from my experience, i think my approach to addiction more closely parallels bereavement counselling than medical treatment. and bereavement is not a disease.

(PS: there is also a huge variation in how i approach addiction, every situation is unique. i have no knowledge of what you have experienced and i am not making any specific comments relating to you personally, just in case you got that impression from me. i do not consider addiction a disease because it does not "fit" with other things we also classify as diseases. in that sense i think i disagree with you, but please do not think i am being critical or dismissive of anything you have achieved.this is an academic point of view, not a personal comment)