The Obama Thread

[fxashun]

What I want to know is who put that mat there in the first place. And who puts a flag on the mat in the name of patriotism?

[the squeeg]

Originally Posted by fxashun

So the other candidates had the time to raise their hands and get the "solemn look" and he was still thinking about whether he had cut the iron off that morning. Yeah, okay.
YouTube - Obama Disrespecting the Flag and US Anthem

Oh my god my ass.

Looks like you heard wrong. But damn did that rendition SUCK. Maybe he did the right thing.

Now, generally, I like the guy - even though I don't believe he has the experience to be the President or have his finger on "The Button" - but this really fried my noodle.

C'mon, Man, you're running to lead the Nation. Show some patriotism

[Katczinsky]

Obama has shown more than enough patriotism. Maybe the fact that people look for patriotism in holding their hand over their chest during the national anthem, or having an American flag lapel pin, rather than not selling the country out to corporate interests is the reason why we're in such shit as we are now. It's so easy to blame everyone but themselves. The voters are definitely culpable. You see it every election; people complain about the same-old BS Washington politics but when push comes to shove they become a poster-child for regurgitated bullshit.

I've learned to look at elections practically. It would be nice to see multiple parties rise to be contenders, but I'm in an important district in an important swing state. If Obama gets the nomination I think it would be wrong not to vote for him, and give a chance to McCain. However, if Hillary gets nominated I think it would be morally reprehensible to extend my (limited) political sovereignty as an American citizen to either one. I think a lot of people would feel the same (on both the left, right, up, and down); everyone besides the middle that is. Right-of-centrists have been running the show for decades and look where it has gotten us.

If it really becomes McCain vs. Clinton, I propose that people instead focus on Ralph Nader vs. Michael Bloomberg (or whoever the libertarian candidate is). Yes, electing a green or a libertarian may require many to cringe at the fact that they're actually taking a stand on something, and may even require them to think the issues through themselves; but at least something will get done and at least democracy would have worked at last.

[nuttyjoe]

Well, yesterday's paper in my area had an article that stated that Obama was actually ahead of Clinton by two delegates. Two questions have certainly been answered for me: 1) The Kennedy family no longer "dictates" life and law in Massachusetts (as evidenced by Clinton's win over Obama despite Kennedy endorsements; and 2) I think America is showing that they are ready to accept the idea of a Black President. The strong support Obama is attracting goes farther than just Oprah's money-there are whites who are supporting him as well. So, that means he is not trying the "Vote for me because I'm Black" song and dance ala Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton.

[fxashun]

I think it's just a shame that the current crop of choices is all we have to choose from. There is not a single candidate with the "chops" you would expect for a President. No matter who eventually get the job, that person will just be result of the general mediocrity we have to choose from.

[nuttyjoe]

Originally Posted by jaaaman

Obama is a member of an all black, racist church with ties to Louise Farahkan.

Imagine if Mitt Romney was a member of a church that was 'unashamebly white'. There would be a huge outcry.

What, Jaaman; in your quote makes Obama a racist? And what has he done personally that makes you define him as such?

[fxashun]

That's really not the point. The mission statement alone would damn a white candidate. Even if in his off time he was a volunteer at the NAACP and had raised 4 adopted black children.

[nuttyjoe]

Originally Posted by fxashun

That's really not the point. The mission statement alone would damn a white candidate. Even if in his off time he was a volunteer at the NAACP and had raised 4 adopted black children.

What statement has been attributed to Obama? It is bad, yes; and it definitely needs rethinking. Statements such as these should not be attributed to any church- Black or White. A church is for worshipping; not for political proseletizing.
I see your point in condemning the statement; but I fail to see how it attaches personally to Obama; as he is not the one who made the statement. Of course, there will be those who say his association with this church is guilt enough. I think this will be trumped up by Clinton, but I think that unless Obama can be shown to have commited some such racial indiscretion personally; this will just not work.
By the way. what's this I'm hearing about the money in Hillary's war chest starting to run low? She had to infuse 7 million of her own money? If this is true, can she last much longer?

[fxashun]

Originally Posted by nuttyjoe

What statement has been attributed to Obama? It is bad, yes; and it definitely needs rethinking. Statements such as these should not be attributed to any church- Black or White. A church is for worshipping; not for political proseletizing.
I see your point in condemning the statement; but I fail to see how it attaches personally to Obama; as he is not the one who made the statement. Of course, there will be those who say his association with this church is guilt enough. I think this will be trumped up by Clinton, but I think that unless Obama can be shown to have commited some such racial indiscretion personally; this will just not work.
By the way. what's this I'm hearing about the money in Hillary's war chest starting to run low? She had to infuse 7 million of her own money? If this is true, can she last much longer?

It attached to Obama when he joined the church. Just as Romney was doomed being a Mormon. He didn't have multiple wives, but that's all you heard about for a while. It's the very same thing.

And yeah, Hillary is in trouble.

[nuttyjoe]

Originally Posted by Katczinsky

Obama has shown more than enough patriotism. Maybe the fact that people look for patriotism in holding their hand over their chest during the national anthem, or having an American flag lapel pin, rather than not selling the country out to corporate interests is the reason why we're in such shit as we are now. It's so easy to blame everyone but themselves. The voters are definitely culpable. You see it every election; people complain about the same-old BS Washington politics but when push comes to shove they become a poster-child for regurgitated bullshit.

I've learned to look at elections practically. It would be nice to see multiple parties rise to be contenders, but I'm in an important district in an important swing state. If Obama gets the nomination I think it would be wrong not to vote for him, and give a chance to McCain. However, if Hillary gets nominated I think it would be morally reprehensible to extend my (limited) political sovereignty as an American citizen to either one. I think a lot of people would feel the same (on both the left, right, up, and down); everyone besides the middle that is. Right-of-centrists have been running the show for decades and look where it has gotten us.

If it really becomes McCain vs. Clinton, I propose that people instead focus on Ralph Nader vs. Michael Bloomberg (or whoever the libertarian candidate is). Yes, electing a green or a libertarian may require many to cringe at the fact that they're actually taking a stand on something, and may even require them to think the issues through themselves; but at least something will get done and at least democracy would have worked at last.

Now, I agree with you there, Katz. People seem to define patriotism according to their own tastes; but one would be hard pressed to find a group of people whom could define it the exact same way.Flying a flag on your property does not make you a patriot- standing behind the symbolism and ideas of the flag being flown does.