Defending the Truth

"Israel has BEEN RECOGNIZED."



You write this long post, that means nothing. If you think PA recognizes Israel, you are even further behind than I thought. Either that or your just in deniel. How can we talk about this issue, when you cant even call a spade a spade?

BTW how the hell can you call Hamas, and Hez, freedom fighters? These people teach children TO BLOW THEM SELFS UP. KILLING INOCENT CIVILIANS NO LESS. If that isnt considerd terrorism, then what the hell is?

how does this idea make any sense? Invading and crushing them will not behoove anyone. it will cause more conflict rather than peace. Its like appeasement in ww2 but to the opposite extreme.

I agree that if we had any brains at all we would take out the nuke sites asap. Everywhere in the world... clean efficient energy, until you have to destroy mountains to store nuclear waste with a shelf-life of 10,000 years, or an accidental melt-down takes place because a nuclear plant is on a fault line or some other act of nature or human error.
The president of Iran and his supporters must have a lot in common with the hard-core American Christian right, wanting to start a world war to bring in the messiah, and take over the world through religion and domination.
I was taught the end was supposed to be up to God/Allah/Yahweh and not up to mankind, but everyone in power seems to be in a hurry to speed things along.
None seem too innocent to me.

Pardon me, but what the heck are you talking about?

If we stopped all the activity that has a deadly grip on this failing country, then less of this would be happening. Would you want to take the chance and not stop the uranium enrichment. Do you want to take that chance and let them develop WMD?

More and more Palestinians don't recognize Israel because Israel doesn't recognize Palestine. In this context I can't blame them too much.

Ok let me put that in context.

If you are a palestinian the following are the sheer REALITIES OF LIFE:

1) Israel enters your country, kills your citizens and destroys your houses with impunity.

2) Israel expands its settlements into YOUR LAND with impunity.

3) Israel decides who comes and goes in and out of your country. Israel decides when or even IF you are allowed control of your sea and air ports.

4) As a result of the above you have no economy to speak of. You have no public facitilites to speak of (health, education, welfare). You have virtually no commerce.

5) As a result of Israel controlling your land, agriculture cannot thrive ( Israel controls all the water). Therefore you cannot produce food for yourself so people starve.

6) Because Palestine has no control over their borders, no commerce, no proper governmental infrastructure it is a defenseless country. As is shown time and again, Israel can come and go as it pleases and do as it pleases. The palestinians have no proper army to defend themselves and they have no weapons to tackle the constant breach of their sovereignty.

6) For every Israeli that dies, 10 Palestinians die.

The above are FACTS. This is not propoganda and it is not an attempt on my part to sully th name of Israel. This is what a palestinian sees and feels every day of his life.

Now lets see how that may affect him.

1) Firstly he probably has no love for the Israelis. As far as he is concerned Israel is an interloper that has torn his land from him. You would feel the same if say the hispanic community in the US decided to claim california as their independent nation.

2) He probably lives under lousy conditions with no healthcare, chronic lack of food, subject to unilateral Israeli incursions that may kill or maim his friends and family or destroy his little hut based on a suspicion.

3) Then comes along an organization that sets up healthcare facilities, gives the kids an education (fine their rhetoric may be a bit strong, but at least his children are learning how to read), and supports him with food and/or cash.

4) The same organization states that it will not be subservient to Israeli domination. The same organization takes up arms ( which is a loose terms as they have no weapons.. instead they make crude weapons of their own and/or even use their own bodies as weapons). They fight the Israeli invaders.

5) Of all the organizations in the world, this is the only one that unequivocally demands HIS independence. It is the ONLY organization that demands HIS right to control his ports and borders. It is the ONLY organization that does not seek to "appease" the Israelis, but retain his sense of nationalism and pride as ESSENTIAL. It is the ONLY organization that puts HIS rights as a human ahead of Israel's right to exist.

Now if you are a palestinian, living under lousy conditions, would you really care WHAT weapon was used to fight the enemy? Would it matter to you how you killed those who kill you and yours? When you are hungry, sick and uneducated, would you really care whether the organizations have a rightist muslim agenda?

You would not care at all. THE ONLY THING YOU WOULD KNOW is that THIS organization is taking care of you. It is fighting for YOUR interests.

The difference between a "freedom fighter" and a "terrorist" depends ENTIRELY on which perspective you are looking from. As far as the palestinians are concerned, the Israeli army is a terrorist organization. Exactly hwo can you claim that THEIR view is wrong (apart fromt he fact that it is not YOUR view)?

The BIGGEST outrage however is the fact that when as a palestinian citizen you FAIRLY and LEGALLY elect a government, the world refuses to accept it. Of all the hypocritical outrages committed by the world (led by the US) in recent times, THIS is the MOST outrageous. The palestinian people legally and DEMOCRATICALLY elected a government and then the world PUNISHES them?

I would say that if EVER there was an action that glorified Hamas, it would be the above. The world has only PROVEN to the palestinians that they CAN NOT DO ANYTHING RIGHT. Even when they have the most fair elections in the ME EVER, they are punished. It hs only galvanized support for Hamas, and created MORE frustrated youths who will GLADLY give their lives. Because they expect NO SUPPORT for their RIGHTS and HUMANS form anywhere in the world.

TO HELL with what Hamas stands for. In america you teach your kids that war is glory. YOU sanctify those soldiers that die in an unjust war. You promise posthumous glory to those that die. You recruit TEENAGERS to join the army to go and kill other humans. Just because your forces have modern weapons somehow you think that YOUR warfare is OK?

Does terrorism only depend on the weapons you use? Or does it depend on which side you are on? Are you going to claim that US soldiers have never killed innocent civilians? Are you going to call those that HAVE killed innocent civilians TERRORISTS? Hell no.. of course not.. because they are "AMERICAN HEROES".

I think the concept of suicide bombings is contrary to Islam. I also think that it is probably the most awful action that can be taken in warfare. But when you are a marginalised people, with no rights, no sovereignty, no control over your borders and ports, no control over your waters, no control over ANYTHING, being attacked at will, having your homes destroyed by bulldozers, having your leaders assasinated by helicopter gunships and being punished for electing an "unacceptable" party in FREE and FAIR elections... THEN an organization that feeds, clothes, cures, educates and FIGHTS for you are considered FREEDOM fighters. And you can in NO WAY CLAIM that you would NOT view it the same were you in their shoes.

Thats some pretty bold statments there chesecake. However, this thread has nothing to do with America. Im sure you can find some other thread to bash us.

Do you have the first clue what Israels policies are tward PA? No you dont. So stop pretending you do.