Defending the Truth

Articles | Interviews | Politicians | Groups | Arcade | Experience | Donate
  Defending the Truth > Political Issues > Environment
Iran: New Power of Tommorow

Environment Debate and defend the issues our world faces on topics such as global warming, environmental pollution, and the many proposals that might help solve these problems.

Closed Thread
Page 5 of 11 < 1234 5 67891011 >
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-09-2007, 05:59 AM   #41 (permalink)
Council Member
 
hkbajwa's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Pakistan
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,179
Points: 5,047, Level: 45
Points: 5,047, Level: 45 Points: 5,047, Level: 45 Points: 5,047, Level: 45
Level up: 49%, 103 Points needed
Level up: 49% Level up: 49% Level up: 49%
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
hkbajwa is offline
 
I do not deny that the Haniyeh has categorically refused to recognize Israel.

Yet again this needs perspective. The PLO recognized Israel in the Oslo Accord. Yet after that the situation only worsened.

So your contention that recognition is all that is required to "fix" things has been proven incorrect by history.

To a palestinian, the historic recognition of Israel did NOT stop the bullying, it did NOT stop the killing, it did NOT stop the settlement expansion, it did NOT return control of land sea and waterways to Palestine, it did NOT improve their lives AT ALL.

In REACTION to the complete lack of improvement IN SPITE of recognition the population then moved to support the party that had actually TANGIBLY helped the population.

Israel seeks to place the "blame" of electing Hamas ( in free and fair elections ) on the Palestinians, when in reality the opinion of the palestinian citizen was led in that direction due to a complete lack of followup ont he committments made by Israel and Yitzak Rabin. Ehud Barak declined to accept the Oslo accord and some of the stipulations made in that. THat my dear friend is the TRUE story.

Palestine did not break the accord first. Ehud Barak did after Rabin's assassination (by a jewish extremist - yeah it seems they got some of those too).

Anyhow this blame game is circular and can never be resolved. However i can say this. If anybody thinks that making the palestinian people MORE miserable is going to reduce Hamas' chances of winning another election and keeping power, they are fabulously wrong.

The palestinian people is a hardened one, and misery no longer destroys them. In fact it only strengthens their resolve and confirms their belief that they must fight fire with fire.

The expectation that the Palestinians will roll over and accept everything is not only unrealistic, it is in fact regressive. As the more powerful, internally stable, richer and empowered party in this conflict the onus is on ISRAEL to find a solution. It is a copout to blame a desparate and exploited people and expect to sacrifice what shreds of pride and independence they retain.
Love for all, Hatred for none
Sponsored Links
Old 03-09-2007, 06:24 AM   #42 (permalink)
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,189
Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Level up: 77%, 47 Points needed
Level up: 77% Level up: 77% Level up: 77%
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Preacherman is offline
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
What about UN resolution 242?

U.N. Security Council Resolution 242 - The United Nations and Israel

Yep the link is a christian web site.


LOL, why dont we just ask them to cut there rists, lol
Old 03-09-2007, 06:25 AM   #43 (permalink)
Council Member
 
hkbajwa's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Pakistan
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,179
Points: 5,047, Level: 45
Points: 5,047, Level: 45 Points: 5,047, Level: 45 Points: 5,047, Level: 45
Level up: 49%, 103 Points needed
Level up: 49% Level up: 49% Level up: 49%
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
hkbajwa is offline
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tyreay View Post
How many times must we be lied to before everyone realizes the threat from Iran is what the Bush Administration is telling us?
Iran has how many nuclear weapons? Even if they had a couple right now, do you think they would use them so we can wipe them off the face of the earth? They are afraid of George Bush and are feeling a need to protect themselves. Just imagine if you lived in a country that our govenment has already label a enemy, the axis of evil. Please.
Please tell me the difference between Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's religious agenda and George Bush's. The difference is only in which God they believe. They both have publicly said that thier Gods talk to them. Hello.......

I agree.. no doubt Iran has to change courses as well. It will simply not do that nuclear weapons proliferate. I mean if Iran gets them, then that opens the floodgates for more and more nations to get them and that will be the death of the NPT.

However the current US tactic of solving issues with threat,s bullying, war and condemnation does nothing, save polarize the world and make enemies of potential friends.

The fact is that Iran has every reason to develop nukes under present circumstances. The way to change their tactic would be to change the circumstances that gives the motivation to create nukes.

And you are totally right. Even ahmedinejad ( no matter how crazy you may think he is) is NOT crazy enough to doom his own nation by chuckin a nuke on Israel or any other nation.

the first nation to USE and nuke will be the first nation to be wiped off the face of the planet for doing so.
Love for all, Hatred for none
Old 03-09-2007, 06:27 AM   #44 (permalink)
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,189
Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Level up: 77%, 47 Points needed
Level up: 77% Level up: 77% Level up: 77%
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Preacherman is offline
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tyreay View Post
How many times must we be lied to before everyone realizes the threat from Iran is what the Bush Administration is telling us?
Iran has how many nuclear weapons? Even if they had a couple right now, do you think they would use them so we can wipe them off the face of the earth? They are afraid of George Bush and are feeling a need to protect themselves. Just imagine if you lived in a country that our govenment has already label a enemy, the axis of evil. Please.
Please tell me the difference between Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's religious agenda and George Bush's. The difference is only in which God they believe. They both have publicly said that thier Gods talk to them. Hello.......

Go ahead and keep your head in the sand. Bush doesnt make Imanutjob, say the things he says. Bush doesnt make Imanutjob, say Israel must be wiped off the map. Bush doesnt make him invite the world to surrender to Islam. Bush doesnt make him say that America will soon die. Bush doesnt make him feel he needs to bring WW3 about to bring in his Messiah. Damn you for making me defend Bush
Old 03-09-2007, 06:32 AM   #45 (permalink)
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,189
Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Level up: 77%, 47 Points needed
Level up: 77% Level up: 77% Level up: 77%
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Preacherman is offline
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hkbajwa View Post
I agree.. no doubt Iran has to change courses as well. It will simply not do that nuclear weapons proliferate. I mean if Iran gets them, then that opens the floodgates for more and more nations to get them and that will be the death of the NPT.

However the current US tactic of solving issues with threat,s bullying, war and condemnation does nothing, save polarize the world and make enemies of potential friends.

The fact is that Iran has every reason to develop nukes under present circumstances. The way to change their tactic would be to change the circumstances that gives the motivation to create nukes.

And you are totally right. Even ahmedinejad ( no matter how crazy you may think he is) is NOT crazy enough to doom his own nation by chuckin a nuke on Israel or any other nation.

the first nation to USE and nuke will be the first nation to be wiped off the face of the planet for doing so.
I must admit, this confuses me. Why is America souly to blame? The whole world agreed to these types of actions tward countries trying to get nuclear weapons illegaly. The world just doesnt have the back bone to go ahead with what they ALL agreed to. Now America is the bad guy, for doing exactly what everyone agreed to to begin with.
Old 03-09-2007, 06:38 AM   #46 (permalink)
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,189
Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Level up: 77%, 47 Points needed
Level up: 77% Level up: 77% Level up: 77%
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Preacherman is offline
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hkbajwa View Post
I do not deny that the Haniyeh has categorically refused to recognize Israel.

Yet again this needs perspective. The PLO recognized Israel in the Oslo Accord. Yet after that the situation only worsened.

So your contention that recognition is all that is required to "fix" things has been proven incorrect by history.

To a palestinian, the historic recognition of Israel did NOT stop the bullying, it did NOT stop the killing, it did NOT stop the settlement expansion, it did NOT return control of land sea and waterways to Palestine, it did NOT improve their lives AT ALL.

In REACTION to the complete lack of improvement IN SPITE of recognition the population then moved to support the party that had actually TANGIBLY helped the population.

Israel seeks to place the "blame" of electing Hamas ( in free and fair elections ) on the Palestinians, when in reality the opinion of the palestinian citizen was led in that direction due to a complete lack of followup ont he committments made by Israel and Yitzak Rabin. Ehud Barak declined to accept the Oslo accord and some of the stipulations made in that. THat my dear friend is the TRUE story.

Palestine did not break the accord first. Ehud Barak did after Rabin's assassination (by a jewish extremist - yeah it seems they got some of those too).

Anyhow this blame game is circular and can never be resolved. However i can say this. If anybody thinks that making the palestinian people MORE miserable is going to reduce Hamas' chances of winning another election and keeping power, they are fabulously wrong.

The palestinian people is a hardened one, and misery no longer destroys them. In fact it only strengthens their resolve and confirms their belief that they must fight fire with fire.

The expectation that the Palestinians will roll over and accept everything is not only unrealistic, it is in fact regressive. As the more powerful, internally stable, richer and empowered party in this conflict the onus is on ISRAEL to find a solution. It is a copout to blame a desparate and exploited people and expect to sacrifice what shreds of pride and independence they retain.

See thats exactly the problem. People need to stop living in the past. The road map to peace was well under way, when PA decided to elect Hamas. Just cause somthing didnt work in the past, doesnt mean it wont work now. Its that adittude that is keeping peace off the table. How do you purpose Israel and PA obtain peace? Let me guess, a long list of demands on the part of Israel, and PA has to do nothing?
Old 03-09-2007, 06:40 AM   #47 (permalink)
Congressional Representative
 
winston53660's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,013
Points: 10,490, Level: 68
Points: 10,490, Level: 68 Points: 10,490, Level: 68 Points: 10,490, Level: 68
Level up: 10%, 360 Points needed
Level up: 10% Level up: 10% Level up: 10%
Activity: 64%
Activity: 64% Activity: 64% Activity: 64%
winston53660 is offline
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preacherman View Post
I must admit, this confuses me. Why is America souly to blame? The whole world agreed to these types of actions tward countries trying to get nuclear weapons illegaly. The world just doesnt have the back bone to go ahead with what they ALL agreed to. Now America is the bad guy, for doing exactly what everyone agreed to to begin with.
GWB has also broken the Non Profilation treaty.
Old 03-09-2007, 06:42 AM   #48 (permalink)
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,189
Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Level up: 77%, 47 Points needed
Level up: 77% Level up: 77% Level up: 77%
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Preacherman is offline
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
GWB has also broken the Non Profilation treaty.


How? WTF are you talking about?
Old 03-09-2007, 07:04 AM   #49 (permalink)
Super Moderator
Moderator
 
tyreay's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: RI
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,897
Country:
Points: 15,165, Level: 79
Points: 15,165, Level: 79 Points: 15,165, Level: 79 Points: 15,165, Level: 79
Level up: 63%, 185 Points needed
Level up: 63% Level up: 63% Level up: 63%
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Send a message via Yahoo to tyreay
tyreay is offline
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preacherman
Go ahead and keep your head in the sand.
With all due respect, if my head is buried in the sand than you are buried with just your toes showing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preacherman
Bush doesnt make Imanutjob, say the things he says.
Fear makes people say alot of messed up things.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preacherman
Bush doesnt make Imanutjob, say Israel must be wiped off the map.
No but he basicly said Iran should be. Same thing from 'Imanutjob's' point of view.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preacherman
Bush doesnt make him invite the world to surrender to Islam.
No, but he does say the world should surrender to Democract(and if it doesn't fit his agenda it is the wrong Democract, the Palistinians are a good example)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preacherman
Bush doesnt make him say that America will soon die.
Do you think Bush's threats against Iran don't surrmount to the same thing in the Iranian's point of view?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preacherman
Bush doesnt make him feel he needs to bring WW3 about to bring in his Messiah.
Bush has already started WW3, it's just not over yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preacherman
Damn you for making me defend Bush
Sorry about that. All I can say is, then don't.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong. ~Richard Armour

There are many men of principle in both parties in America, but there is no party of principle. ~Alexis de Tocqueville
Old 03-09-2007, 07:51 AM   #50 (permalink)
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,189
Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45 Points: 5,103, Level: 45
Level up: 77%, 47 Points needed
Level up: 77% Level up: 77% Level up: 77%
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Preacherman is offline
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tyreay View Post
With all due respect, if my head is buried in the sand than you are buried with just your toes showing.May have so.
Fear makes people say alot of messed up things.Thats your excuse for the leader of a powerful nation, running off at the mouth saying evil and destructive things? Come on now. He doesnt look the least bit affraid to me. It looks like he is loving every second of this.
No but he basicly said Iran should be. Same thing from 'Imanutjob's' point of view.No he didnt.
No, but he does say the world should surrender to Democract(and if it doesn't fit his agenda it is the wrong Democract, the Palistinians are a good example) The people of the world would agree. There leaders many not, but the people are for it. Especialy in Iran.
Do you think Bush's threats against Iran don't surrmount to the same thing in the Iranian's point of view?Bushes threats to Iran, have everything to do with Iran defiance of the security councle, and there total lack of respect for the opinions of world powers.
Bush has already started WW3, it's just not over yet.Yea, cause Bush flew those planes in to the WTC.
Sorry about that. All I can say is, then don't.
I dont like Bush at all. But Imanutjob, makes Bush look like Santa Claus.
,
Closed Thread
Page 5 of 11 < 1234 5 67891011 >

Bookmarks

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Thread Tools
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:03 AM.

Defending the Truth - FAQ - Contact Us - Donate - Archive - Top

 Top Political Sites
Poltical Topsites 

Recommended Sites