What part of "CONGRESS SHALL MAKE NO LAW RESPECTING AN ESTABLISHMENT OF RELIGION, OR PROHIBITING THE FREE EXERCISE THEREOF;"..........do you not understand. What you advocate denies people of faith their justly due rights.

You just proved my point. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion." Meaning that the U.S. government doesn't involve itself in religious matters if the church doesn't involve itself in governmental matters.

Well, then, Anti, you need to tell that to the courts...I believe they are part of the government. They have been consistently injecting themselves into religious matters for decades now. Indeed, that's the cause of the ruckus over abortion, homosexual marriage, etc. The religious folk who have spoken out are branded and labeled hateful and bigots and devisive.....but in reality, it's the interference of state into church that is causing all the divisiveness.

Doncha think?

If someone already posted this article, I am sorry. I lost track of the new posts on this thread, but read this on a friend's blog ( and before folk think I am posting this to be hateful, read my way early posts here. I am the same person. But I also do believe that we cannot simply cos the man died, negate the damaging message he conveyed or think it will not be found on the lips of another taking up his mantle of advancing a political hate party in the name of god ) :
OD

Jerry Falwell's Hit ParadeThe right's holy fool.

By Timothy Noah
Posted Tuesday, May 15, 2007, at 6:56 PM ET
God, they say, is love, but the Rev. Jerry Falwell, who died May 15, hit the jackpot trafficking in small-minded condemnation. The controversies Falwell generated followed a predictable loop. 1.) Falwell would say something hateful or clownish about some person or group associated with liberalism. 2.) A public outcry would ensue. 3.) Falwell would apologize and retract the offending comment. 4.) Falwell would repeat the comment, slightly rephrased.
For 20 years, evangelicals have chided the mainstream media for treating Falwell's ghastly pronouncements as news; Falwell, they often confide in private, ceased being a significant figure well before he left his signature political organization, the Moral Majority, in 1987. If so, someone forgot to tell Sen. John McCain, R.-Ariz., who as a presidential candidate in 2000 condemned Falwell's intolerance ("The political tactics of division and slander are not our values, they are corrupting influences on religion and politics, and those who practice them in the name of religion or in the name of the Republican Party or in the name of America shame our faith, our party and our country") but last year, as a presidential candidate positioning for 2008, made peace with Falwell and gave a commencement address ("We have nothing to fear from each other") to the 2006 graduating class at Falwell's Liberty University. On news of Falwell's death, McCain said in a statement, "Dr. Falwell was a man of distinguished accomplishment who devoted his life to serving his faith and country."
Nonsense. He was a bigot, a reactionary, a liar, and a fool. Herewith, a Falwell sampler.

On Sept. 11: "The abortionists have got to bear some burden for this because God will not be mocked. And when we destroy 40 million little innocent babies, we make God mad. I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People for the American Way—all of them who have tried to secularize America—I point the finger in their face and say 'you helped this happen.' "

On AIDS: "AIDS is the wrath of a just God against homosexuals."

On homosexuality: "I believe that all of us are born heterosexual, physically created with a plumbing that's heterosexual, and created with the instincts and desires that are basically, fundamentally, heterosexual. But I believe that we have the ability to experiment in every direction. Experimentation can lead to habitual practice, and then to a lifestyle. But I don't believe anyone begins a homosexual."

On Martin Luther King Jr.: "I must personally say that I do question the sincerity and non-violent intentions of some civil rights leaders such as Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., Mr. James Farmer, and others, who are known to have left-wing associations."

On Martin Luther King Jr., four decades later: "You know, I supported Martin Luther King Jr., who did practice civil disobedience."

On public education: "I hope I live to see the day when, as in the early days of our country, we won't have any public schools. The churches will have taken them over again, and Christians will be running them."

On the separation of church and state: "There is no separation of church and state."

On feminists: "I listen to feminists and all these radical gals. ... These women just need a man in the house. That's all they need. Most of the feminists need a man to tell them what time of day it is and to lead them home. And they blew it and they're mad at all men. Feminists hate men. They're sexist. They hate men; that's their problem."

On global warming: "I can tell you, our grandchildren will laugh at those who predicted global warming. We'll be in global cooling by then, if the Lord hasn't returned. I don't believe a moment of it. The whole thing is created to destroy America's free enterprise system and our economic stability."

On Bishop Desmond Tutu: "I think he's a phony, period, as far as representing the black people of South Africa."

On Islam: "I think Mohammed was a terrorist. I read enough of the history of his life, written by both Muslims and non-Muslims, that he was a violent man, a man of war."

On Jews: "In my opinion, the Antichrist will be a counterfeit of the true Christ, which means that he will be male and Jewish, since Jesus was male and Jewish."

Rest in peace, you blowhard.

It's the other way around. People are using religion as an excuse to legislate what they think is right and have been doing so for a number of years. It's only when courts respond by saying that they can't are they called "hostile" towards religion. In reality no governmental office has ever forced their opinion on the church, which is a private institution. There has been no challenge to their core beliefs and no effort to change any churc doctrine. If there has been or ever will be, it's 100% wrong.

What kills me is that conservative christians claim they're being threatened while they have a great deal of control in Congress and are one of the largest public interest group in the country. Those who are the most vocal attempt to model American laws based on biblical ones. If that's not a violation of the First Amendment, I don't know what is.

On the contrary, people of faith have just as much right to see laws passed that they believe to be right as anyone else.. we do not "USE RELIGION AS AN EXCUSE" as you claim. When the courts say that we can't, then we are denied the constitutional rights that we are entitled to.

As an example, It is my deeply held religious belief that life begins at conception. Because I believe this, I am deeply saddened when I hear of the holocaust of so many innocent pre-born babies that are killed each year.

Roe v Wade is bad law and needs to be overturned just as Dred-Scott was bad law (slavery). I am glad that it was eventually overturned and slavery, abolished.

The Reverend Falwell had the right to speak his opinion and have it acted upon just as much as the ACLU, PETA, or NOW. He did not hate, but many hated him because he pointed out ther sin.

But by getting those laws passed, there is the assumption that everybody agrees with them. Not everybody shares your views on abortion, gay marriage, euthanasia, etc. I, for one, would rather die than be lying in a bed hooked up to life support with no complex brain function for the rest of my life. Who are you to say I'm wrong? And why would you say it? Because you hold a differing opinion?

If you don't like abortion, don't get one. More importantly, don't tell somebody you don't even know and don't even understand what they should do when you don't know their name, age, history, or other circumstances. Hold your views if you wish, and if you come across the situation in which you need to decide, by all means go with your heart, but you have no insight into the hearts of others, so don't act like you know what's best for them.

That's why I don't like religion mixing with politics. It sets forward a moral standard that not everyody adheres to. Don't marry a man, don't abort a fetus, don't pull the plug on a relative, don't have sex before marriage, and don't get divorced if that's what floats your boat, but out of common courtesy to others, don't budge in and make their decisions on those matters for them.

It's all up to the choices we make, our own will to do what we feel as right and necessary for ourselves. Go social libertarianism!

I really don't like it when people take certain things people are quoted as saying and post it as the gospel truth on a website. Some of these quotes actually could convey some other meaning... but one would not be able to get that just from 1 or 2 sentence soundbites. Also, we all say things we should not say or regret later saying... he just happened to be a controversial character and everything he said in public ended up in print in some fashion or form. And what about the things he said in public that absolutely hit the nail on the head? This picking and choosing of short little soundbites is really dishonest in my opinion...

And he deserves better in his death than to be called a 'blowhard'.

I was gonna organize to have his funeral at a mosque, have Elton John play "Candle in the Wind," and bury him between Anton LaVey & Andrea Dworkin.

Jaaman, for the record, I copied and pasted those words, not my own. Though I would rather point out what I disagree with concerning Falwell's blatant display of intolerant, prideful and bigoted beliefs, I would not personally call him a blowhard. It's not really in my vocabulary.
You know what, Jaaman? I find it also picking and choosing, not just the sound bytes that people share of what the man has ever said, but I find it picking and choosing that he picked out certain behaviors, orientations, religions and beliefs to rail against, but when did he ever say anything against gluttony? Hmmm. Wonder why that was???
No, I won't call him blowhard, but I will say he was a hypocrite and a mean spirited man, who got too big for his own britches.

OD