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Gun Control Debate and defend whether or not you believe that the second amendment protects individual rights to bear arms.

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Old 04-17-2007, 11:05 PM   #261 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by garysher View Post
Interesting theory - does anyone else agree with it or is it yours and yours alone?
I agree in part. I think we do have too much fear coming from the mainstream media - it's one of the reasons I don't consume it anymore.

I agree that gun control is not the answer. Rage comes from human beings, not guns. Before it was rage it was something else, likely anger, depression, frustration, etc. Helping each other handle these negative emotions might help defuse the bombs inside us.
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Old 04-17-2007, 11:08 PM   #262 (permalink)
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Chris 967; we seem to think alike.Guys; I still believe we need to better concentrate our efforts on finding out the reasons this student went on this spree. After reading today's paper (4/17) I am looking at reports of this young man writing plays based on violence- he's practically screaming for help- this young man was a ticking time bomb.
Why can't we notice the warning signs, people? Granted, not everybody reacts to personal problems (thank heavens!) in this manner. I believe that intervention and the lack of it was the problem here. The only intervention was from some brave students afterwards.
But what happened when this individual was writing violent plays and discussing shooting sprees at school? This was the critical point where this behavior should have been reported! Perhaps this tragedy might have been diverted or avoided outright.
Incidentally, while I feel very sorry for the parents of all the victims; this outcry for the firing of the president of Virginia Tech holds no water to me. If he is to blamed for anything; it would be if he provided the weapon illegally. I don't believe he could have done anything more than anyone elsecould have.

Last edited by nuttyjoe; 04-17-2007 at 11:11 PM. Reason: acknowlegement of earlier quote
Old 04-17-2007, 11:47 PM   #263 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garysher View Post
[color=Red]So you want guns so you can shoot at cameras??
No, so we can shoot Big Brother.

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On that bogus surveillance issue, are you aware that you are being photogrpahed every time you use an ATM, visit a gas station, bank, supermarket, etc etc?
Those are private surveillance cameras put up by businesses intended to prevent people from stealing their merchandise. In London, however, the CCTV cameras are government operated, on public property and every street (some can even look inside people's flats), and are intended to watch the people, take away their privacy, and to stop "anti-social behavior". Americans would never allow it to get as bad as cameras yelling at us that our behavior is questionable or "anti-social".

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The average American is photographed every bit as much as his British counterpart, but at least we don't have the unofficial National ID of the SSN#.
We're definitely not photographed as much as our British counterpart. And the instances in which we are, it isn't by the government who keeps our records of where we go at all times, like in Britain of coarse. And you have a small point on the SSN#, but it's still not used as a form of national ID. You Brits, however, will soon be enjoying an official National ID card filled with excellent scannable (and hackable) information including "fingerprints, digitised facial scan and iris scan, current and past UK and overseas places of residence of all residents of the UK throughout their lives and indexes to other Government databases - which would allow them to be connected. The legislation also says that any further information can be added."
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As for tracking devices, whenever your cell phone is switched on you can be located to within 6 feet. Your car's GPS system or LoJack device provides the same convenience to those guys in dark suits!
These are hypotheticals. They "can" trace you via your cell phone granted the cell phone company works with the government. And unlike your cars in Britain, our cell phones and GPS systems can be turned off or we can opt to not have them.

And I'm aware of privacy infringements of this administration like unwarranted wiretaps...but the point I was making in the difference between our two nations is that once something gets out like them using unwarranted wiretaps, there's outrage and political opposition in Congress. But the Brits take it up the ass and in obvious doublethink manner don't even realize the cameras are there watching their every movement...or if they do they don't consciously acknowledge the gravity of it.

And obviously, we have the Patriot Act, which I agree is an Orwellian piece of legislation...but its still far behind what you guys are doing in the UK.
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Old 04-17-2007, 11:52 PM   #264 (permalink)
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*claps hands for Kat* couldnt of said it better myself....seriously i couldnt lol
Old 04-18-2007, 12:03 AM   #265 (permalink)
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Why is it that some people try to place the blame on someone else? The blame for this tragedy falls on ONE person ONLY...The KILLER!!!!!
This is not the fault of the school administration,the gun companies,the NRA or anyone else except for the person who pulled the trigger.
Granted he obviously was a screwed up individual....but it was his actions that were to blame,not this so-called American fascination with guns,not the right wing gun owners nor the left wing anti-gun crowd nor anyone else but one person.
We all are very saddened about the events at VA.Tech. but trying to place blame at the feet of people who had nothing to do with this is asinine.If you want to stop gun violence,take the guns out of the hands of criminals and people who are not mentally competent enough to respect the lives of others,not out of the hands of millions of law-abiding people who hunt,target shoot,collect or have them for self-defense.
Yes,I am a gun owner.I am not a criminal nor should I be treated like one just because I own a gun.
Old 04-18-2007, 12:10 AM   #266 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duncanmac View Post
Why is it that some people try to place the blame on someone else? The blame for this tragedy falls on ONE person ONLY...The KILLER!!!!!
This is not the fault of the school administration,the gun companies,the NRA or anyone else except for the person who pulled the trigger.
Granted he obviously was a screwed up individual....but it was his actions that were to blame,not this so-called American fascination with guns,not the right wing gun owners nor the left wing anti-gun crowd nor anyone else but one person.
We all are very saddened about the events at VA.Tech. but trying to place blame at the feet of people who had nothing to do with this is asinine.If you want to stop gun violence,take the guns out of the hands of criminals and people who are not mentally competent enough to respect the lives of others,not out of the hands of millions of law-abiding people who hunt,target shoot,collect or have them for self-defense.
Yes,I am a gun owner.I am not a criminal nor should I be treated like one just because I own a gun.
I don't think anyone was trying to place the blame of this incident on anything other than the individual.

I, personally was talking about why there is an obviously large difference between the number of killings by guns in the United States per year than there are anywhere else in the industrialized world. More tying in with the subject of the thread and not the VA Tech shootings.
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Old 04-18-2007, 09:01 AM   #267 (permalink)
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All lives lost is a tragedy
Surely others too have heard or considered for themselves the reaction to the tragic school shooting, and that by our President.
His first response to be an empathy and offer to pray for the families and friends of the victims, AND his reaffirming his political stand to maintain the rights of citizens to bear arms.

I am kind of sad that an event of this magnitude has to be met even at the onset with political speak at all.

But then, too, I thought about it harder and realize that as devastating as this event is, we do know that the lives were taken by a crazed and troubled young man. A loner who was acting out, no doubt from deeply rooted issues of mental illness.
And yet, what do we tell the families and friends of those whose lives are taken in the Iraqi War?
I guess it is really no surprise that the President speaks immediate about a political issue in the wake of tragedy and loss, his whole presidency seems to be characterized by justifying political pursuits in the wake of so much senseless horror.

OD
Old 04-18-2007, 12:02 PM   #268 (permalink)
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It was obviously in reaction to the already evident outcry of the leftists who wish us to pervert and change our Constitution to their political ends of disarming us all that made it necessary for the president to mention anything about it. It's not "political" or "justifying" anything to stand on the Constitution that we already have.
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Old 04-18-2007, 12:11 PM   #269 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vharlow View Post
It was obviously in reaction to the already evident outcry of the leftists who wish us to pervert and change our Constitution to their political ends of disarming us all that made it necessary for the president to mention anything about it. It's not "political" or "justifying" anything to stand on the Constitution that we already have.

I'm sorry Vharlow but I have to disagree with you.

Nothing was going to change if the President would have simply offered a heart of concern and sorrow in the wake of the school shooting.

He did not need to use the tragedy as a soapbox.

And if you claim that the liberals did, then, he still did not need to address that. He could have simply shown some humanity.

OD
Old 04-18-2007, 12:17 PM   #270 (permalink)
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What people fail to realize is that this shooting does nothing to prove the point of gun control advocates. This kid could have just as easily gon on a rampage and run over 33 people in the street... Or he could have strapped a bomb to his chest... Or any number of other attacks that have nothing to do with firearms...

People should not be so eager to dispose of their liberties...
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