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| Health Care Debate and defend your thoughts on the current health care system. Compare and contrast the current health care system of the US to other countries. |
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| | #31 (permalink) | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Senator ![]() Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Columbus, OH Gender: ![]() Posts: 3,758 Country: ![]()
| Finger pointing in a natural disaster. France was hit the most severely by the heat wave, and coupled with the fact that most people were on vacation created a perfect storm. Whether or not the health system is to blame is -as the article you cut and pasted from pointed out- a matter of controversy. Still, nonetheless, as you point out, Mattei lost his position. The American people have absolutely no check on the corporate powers that run our health system. And considering this was in 2003, and with a not-for-profit system, they were able reform their system to become better responders to future heat waves. The American industry does not change at all unless it concerns profitability. We have our own closet full of skeletons, and unlike the French, we have not learned or adapted as a result (see Katrina). Considering France has the best health system in all areas (including response) in the world according to the World Health Organization's analysis, I could only imagine the impact such a disaster would have if it happened in the United States. This was a natural disaster (the worst heat wave in recorded European history) that killed 14,802 (mostly elderly) in France. And while the complacency of a faulty health system is highly dubious at best, this number doesn't even reach the annual deaths undeniably caused directly by the systemic problems of the US health industry (as opposed to a natural disaster). Hardly an example of people 'falling dead due to long lines'. "If you want to achieve peace of mind and happiness, then have faith; if you want to be a disciple of truth, then search" -- Friedrich Nietzsche Economic Left/Right: -9.50 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.72 Last edited by Katczinsky; 08-07-2008 at 11:09 PM. | |||||||||||||||||||||
| The Following User Says Thank You to Katczinsky For This Useful Post: | AlicornsPrayer ![]() (08-07-2008) |
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| | #32 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Village Idiot Join Date: Jul 2008 Gender: ![]() Posts: 1,220
| Quote:
If this happened in the US, hospitals, doctors and Insurance companies would be sued for Billions. There would be people facing a criminal Grand Jury. Each state in the US regulates health Insurance/healthcare. State Legislators approve the Insurance contracts and audits Insurance companies, healthcare facilities etc...The Feds have some input. If you have ANY healthcare complaints, you should take them up with your state representatives! | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| | #33 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Partisan Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Los Angeles Gender: ![]() Posts: 11,784 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
How many Americans died because of Katrina? Did the government ever publish that figure? And how man Americans die every year because they can't afford health care? Or because their insurance company finds some way to wriggle out of paying? knowuryder: and I should care what some dullard on a message board thinks about me because why exactly? | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| | #34 (permalink) | |||||||||||||||||||||||
| Moderator Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Dallas area, TX Gender: ![]() Posts: 1,225 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
20% (9.4 million) - currently eligible for existing programs 10% (4.7 million) - college students who should be inexpensive to insure 20% (9.4 million) - non-US citizens who are in the country legally (I don't believe Americans should have to subsidize their health care. I don't have data on the number of illegal immigrants) 20% (9.4 million) - household income over $75,000 (and even though my family falls into this bracket, I agree that there should be a coverage mandate for those of us who can afford it) That's about 32.9 million who shouldn't be "uninsured" because they can/should be covered by already existing programs. 'We all pay for the uninsured' - May. 1, 2008 Quote:
Recission is another issue that's tied into things like cost control and fraud, which needs to be addressed as well. There are a lot - A LOT - of problems with the way insurance is handled today. But it's not "the fault of the insurance companies" that healthcare spending is so out of control in this country. There is more than enough blame to go around - the insurers, the pharmaceuticals, the uninsured, the individual who chooses to ignore a problem when it's small and inexpensive, the government. Bitching and moaning and finger-pointing doesn't solve anything. Stepping up and taking responsibility for ourselves and our choices does... or at least it makes a start. PROPAGANDA: What lies behind us and lies before us are small matters compared to what lies right to our faces. FactCheck.org - Check it out! | |||||||||||||||||||||||
| The Following User Says Thank You to Tirya For This Useful Post: | AlicornsPrayer ![]() (08-08-2008) |
| | #35 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Partisan Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Los Angeles Gender: ![]() Posts: 11,784 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
I think your stats are wide open to accusations of being fallacious knowuryder: and I should care what some dullard on a message board thinks about me because why exactly? | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| | #36 (permalink) | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Moderator Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Dallas area, TX Gender: ![]() Posts: 1,225 Country: ![]()
| That's why I included the source, Einstein. Feel free to verify them yourself. PROPAGANDA: What lies behind us and lies before us are small matters compared to what lies right to our faces. FactCheck.org - Check it out! | |||||||||||||||||||||
| The Following User Says Thank You to Tirya For This Useful Post: | AlicornsPrayer ![]() (08-08-2008) |
| | #37 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Partisan Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Los Angeles Gender: ![]() Posts: 11,784 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
Most people get health insurance through their employers, which imposes a huge overhead on that business. It also limits employees to whatever the employer determines will suffice. And if times are hard the company will well reduce coverage or switch to a cheaper insurer. Many self-employed people are under insured because they simply cannot afford $1500-$3000 a month on insurance premiums, especially if a family member has a health problem. Or a 'pre-existing condition' as insurers prefer to call it. Statutory minimums on health insurance are exactly that - minimums. They may be mandatory but they leave drivers under-insured in most cases, especially for coverage of their own vehicle. You may be willing to risk writing off a $500 car but not your son's asthma, so I don't see that your analogy holds water knowuryder: and I should care what some dullard on a message board thinks about me because why exactly? | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| | #38 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Partisan Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Los Angeles Gender: ![]() Posts: 11,784 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
Just confirming that you have no means of verifying these stats and can offer no reasonable defence. knowuryder: and I should care what some dullard on a message board thinks about me because why exactly? | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| | #39 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Moderator Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Dallas area, TX Gender: ![]() Posts: 1,225 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
You want to argue about them? Cite your sources. PROPAGANDA: What lies behind us and lies before us are small matters compared to what lies right to our faces. FactCheck.org - Check it out! | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| The Following User Says Thank You to Tirya For This Useful Post: | AlicornsPrayer ![]() (08-08-2008) |
| | #40 (permalink) | |||||||||||||||||||||||
| Moderator Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Dallas area, TX Gender: ![]() Posts: 1,225 Country: ![]()
| Quote:
It also means that if you choose to get the bare-bones insurance on your Ferrari, then you total it in Malibu Canyon, it's not my responsibility to help you make up the difference between your insurance coverage and your cost of replacing it. Quote:
But they are not all the fault of the insurance companies. A lot of the problems that currently exist are also the result of Americans' choices. And that's something that each of us can change. If you're overweight, lose weight. If you smoke, quit. If you drink, do so in moderation. If people put half as much "preventive maintenance" into their bodies as they do into their automobiles, I can't help but think they'd have a lot smaller "repair bills". Personal responsibility, Gary. Try it some time. PROPAGANDA: What lies behind us and lies before us are small matters compared to what lies right to our faces. FactCheck.org - Check it out! | |||||||||||||||||||||||
| The Following User Says Thank You to Tirya For This Useful Post: | AlicornsPrayer ![]() (08-08-2008) |
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