That is all and good but do you work in a hospital or an ER?????

I do!!!!!! People come in all the time and are treated, no one is turned away regardless of their complaint. Not all ER visits are life threatening. And ERs do provide this type service. Insulin is given, prescriptions for more medicines, and the list goes on. One more attempt to change the definitions of words, but reality bites!!!!!

dmk

Firstly, I don't work in an ER but since you don't have to work in an ER to read I guess that I could just read a summary of the only law that applies:

EMTALA/EMTALA Resources for hospitals

Here it is in a nutshell:

In order to be in compliance with EMTALA, the hospital must meet 2 primary obligations:

1. When an individual shows up for treatment at a hospital's emergency room, "the hospital must provide for an appropriate medical screening examination . . . to determine whether or not an emergency medical condition" exists (see 42 USC § 1395dd[a]).
2. If the screening examination indicates that an emergency medical condition does exist, the hospital ordinarily must "stabilize the medical condition" before transferring or discharging the patient.

Secondly, I do believe that as you said some ERs do provide the types of services that you described most are probably county or university hospitals which receive funding from local government. However that is not the point, this conversation is about the legal requirements for every hospital to provide healthcare service through the ER. Which would have to be the case for your previous argument that Emergency Medical Service (hence the name Emergency Room) = Healthcare for everyone to be true.

Since you seem to believe that this is what all hospitals are already doing across the country let's just make it the law then we could catch those couple of hospital administrators that are chasing their bottom line instead of their patients welfare since running a hospital is an altruistic endeavor and not a business. We could say all hospitals are required to treat everyone for any condition life threatening or not in the ER regardless of their ability to pay as you said your hospital is already doing. Since that is what you claim is already going on everywhere it should be an easy win/win for everyone.

Hmm, and to think I thought that you didn't support socialized healthcare when you've been doing it all along at work everyday. Now that's how you start a grassroots movement.

The simple fact is we have laws to enforce a behavior. In order to increase the liklihood of a behavior being universally exhibited by hospitals there would need to be a law requiring it. Because there isn't such a law, how can you even hope to guarantee that all hospitals across the nation are even willing to consider providing anything above the legal minimum to patients with no insurance and no ability to pay.

Bottom line you are only guaranteed to receive stabilizing treatment as described by law anything else and you are entirely at the mercy of the hospital.

The best part of this argument is that since you work at a hospital in the ER you could post your hospital's emergency room patient treatment/transfer policy.

P.S. If the definition of the words was changed enlighten us with the original definitions.

You will find a big sign, in EVERY hospital ER in the country, saying exactly what Sarge & I have been saying.

That IS health-care. And we have it.

Look I respect your opinions and hunches.

However, show me the law that says that I will receive treatment for non life threatening conditions regardless of my ability to pay or insurance status at the ER and I will concede.

What the law guarantees for you at the ER is treatment from life threatening conditions. If this is all that you think people need treatment for then I guess the law guarantees Healthcare for all. What you all are arguing is that individual hospital policy guarantees treatment for all and I say that is not good enough. A sign on a wall not backed by law is just a sign that the hospital can change at will.

I am not necessarily pro socialized medicine I just want to call a duck a duck and a cat a cat.

I guess that I should start scheduling my annual physicals at the ER instead of my family doctor since those are the types of services they provide there.

Why would you schedule your annual physical in the ER? Nobody - in their right mind - does that.

And even if you did NOT have ANY kind of health-care insurance, you'd be better off just paying out of pocket for your annual physical, then to pay $500 per month, just to cover the cost of your $250 physical - which you'd have to pay for anyway, because of deductible & co-payment.

Bottom line: ANYBODY can get necessary health-care in America. What else do you need?

What do you consider necessary health-care?
What do you consider unnecessary health-care. Before you answer let's agree to eliminate elective procedures because obviously those are unnecessary health-care.

My issue is that I consider all nonelective needs necessary healthcare and it seems to me that you are saying that everyone in America regardless of insurance or ability to pay is able to receive all of their nonelective healthcare needs through the ER if they can't afford to pay. I am asking you to prove it by showing me the piece of legislation that ensures that entitlement to people who can't afford to pay and have no insurance.

I have shown you the law the entitles people to receive stabilizing treatment. Now I just want you to reciprocate and show me the legislation that entitles people to receive more than that minimum as you argue is available for people who can't pay and have no insurance.

If I don't reply right away it's because I'm unavailable for the weekend. Talk to you guys Monday.

Jefferson/SgtDMSKI - Have a great weekend.

This discussion is indeed very interesting.

This is a perfect example of how a good and friendly debate can open up on Defending the Truth.

I hope this debate continues...I have yet to express my opinions.

Yeah, and I have yet to stomp his lilly-white butt into the ground.

You know how it is!










...actually, I think Thunder-Hole (I like the name) is probably a really good guy.

No one is turned away from health care in the USA. Those who can't pay are covered by the payments of those with insurance, whether it be privae or government. Someone ends up paying for those who can't. People not having health care in this country is a myth.

I have seen people use the ER to get a screening exam for their children to go to school, to play sports, and even for themselves to get jobs or even check their own health. People know that the ER cannot turn them away and so they will come in and complain that they do not feel well and have the testing done and evaluated for them. So again we see that for every complaint that is espoused and for every statement they make about people not getting care, it is a myth.

Perhaps if a few more people spent a day in the life of some of us who work for the system they would see the problems. This year I will not be getting a pay raise, nor a cost of living raise, why??? Because the hospital is spending too much money - where is it all going, paying for he care of those who cannot pay for themselves.

dmk