Hio

Agreed

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What Profit Is It To A Man...If He Gains The World But Loses His Own Soul {Matthew 16:26}

nuttyjoe

She's trying to sue the local police for negligence in not arresting my father; according to the city attorney.

foundit66

While I think she is being an idiot, on what possible grounds could a counter-suit be made?

__________________
"(Gay marriage) is a debate about whether you think gay people are part of the human condition or just a random fetish."
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"Please don't judge others by your own standards."
-- Garysher

knot_e_lady

In all fairness, the main reason that they banned smoking on the beach in California was not because of the smoke, per se, but because of the butts left in the sand.

You know how gross it is to have your little guys playing in the sand, and they stick in their shovel and come up with cigarette butts?

Maybe if smokers were a little more considerate and didn't throw their butts all over the place, things would be a little easier for them.

You know how many time I've seen a flaming butt fly out of the window of the car driving in front of me? Why is that okay? Or sitting at a stop light, and you look down at the curb and it is scattered with cigarette butts.

If smokers want people to be more sympathetic towards them, they need to clean up after themselves. My mom and sister both smoke, and they carry a little tin with them everywhere, as well as a baggy, so if they do smoke outside they take their butts with them and dispose of them properly.

nuttyjoe

I can agree with you there, Knot E Lady. But isn't that what the cigarette urn is for?

knot_e_lady

You would think, huh?

For example, outside my husband's office there is a cig urn, but inevitably there are butts stewn all around in the bushes and in the grass. Same at my mom's apt. building.

I don't care if people smoke. I grew up with smokers, although I never have myself. What I do mind is when they leave their mess around for others to clean up.

foundit66

Seconded.
It's amazing how many cigarette butts you see lying around. I have actually seen smokers take the ash tray out of their car to dump it in a parking lot of a store / restaurant.

Not saying all do that, but when it comes to soda cans or candy wrappers, the "littering" is nowhere near the amount for cigarette butts.

Personally, I would be more tempted to have somebody lay out some 'littering' fines on a beach or public area to get the point across, but I can understand how the police may have some more pressing matters on their hands...

__________________
"(Gay marriage) is a debate about whether you think gay people are part of the human condition or just a random fetish."
-- Jon Stewart
"Please don't judge others by your own standards."
-- Garysher

nuttyjoe

Well, today was fun. after waiting forever and a day outside the city attorney's office, we hopefully got this mess straightened out. It turns out that the actual wording in the city ordinance does in no way prohibit smoking outdoors.
The woman and her lawyer (I'm assuming that's who he was) were told that if they disageed with the wording of the ordinance;they need to attend a city council meeting and bring it up then. Until then, nothing was going to be done.
Very stubborn woman. She proceeded to scream that people smoking outdoors should be in a designated area.
The city attorney explained to her that there was such an area and that my father was in it while smoking his cigarette.
The woman wanted to know how she was supposed to know of such an area.
She was informed that the presence of the cigarette urn(owned by the restaurant) constituted such an area; and that she should not approach such an area if cigarettes bother her so.
At this the meeting broke; the woman left-muttering all sorts of insults.
I'm glad this mess is over, now I can get back to sending Ali more recipes!

sgtdmski

But a restaurant, bar, coffee shop, etc are not public places, they are private establishments. If these establishments wish to allow patrons who smoke to remain indoors then that is their right. If a non-smoker does not wish to frequent these establishments, then this is their right.

Let the free market dictate. If you do not want to smell smoke when you go to eat, then go eat at a place that does not allow smoking. If not, then the only person you have to blame for your own discomfort is yourself.

dmk

__________________
Conservatism, I repeat is not an ideology. It does not breed fanatics....But if you want men who seek, reasonably and prudently, to reconcile the best in wisdom of our ancestors with the change which is essential to a vigorous civil social existence, then you will do well to turn to conservative principles
-Russell Kirk-

sgtdmski

I agree. Smoking should be banned in public buildings, meaning those that belong to the people through the government. This is already the case. You cannot smoke in state, federal or even local governmental buildings.

However, do not confuse private establishments with public places. Private establishments have the right to freedom of association. If this means associating with patrons that smoke, any demand for any other action is unconstitutional.

dmk

__________________
Conservatism, I repeat is not an ideology. It does not breed fanatics....But if you want men who seek, reasonably and prudently, to reconcile the best in wisdom of our ancestors with the change which is essential to a vigorous civil social existence, then you will do well to turn to conservative principles
-Russell Kirk-