Defending the Truth

This is BULLSHIT!!!!
Giving illegals driver's licenses??????

Agreed.
I don't get it at all.
It just sounds like a direct plan to circumvent the existing laws regarding immigration.

I would be curious about any "plans" for car insurance for these drivers...

I don't think that it is okay that some people spend a lot of time and money to come here and those that cheat the system get the same benefits.

You know, it's amazing that our elected officials have decided that our borders are hardly worth protecting and that any one who makes it here, is eligible for rights and priveledges even though they have nothing at stake here and have done nothing to earn them.

My problem in this area is again, the circular arguments and views that we Americans have. Do we not already require proof of residence and other such documentation when one applies for a driver's license? Of course we do. Why cannot we require this of anyone applying for such? And if the required documentation cannot be furnished; the result be the same as it is for all of us? NO LICENSE!
Don't even get me started on insurance (automobile). I am bull-headed on this point that I believe in mandatory auto insurance. Yes, there are many Mexicans all over America driving without such; and when an accident occurs- they head back for an extended stay.

CNN — LOU DOBBS TONIGHT — Aired October 2, 2007 - 18:00 ET

KITTY PILGRIM, GUEST HOST: He's facing strong opposition, but New York State Governor Eliot Spitzer is pushing ahead with his plan it give drivers licenses to illegal aliens. As Bill Tucker reports, opponents are raising new legal and political obstacles.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BILL TUCKER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In New York State, illegal aliens will soon be welcomed and protected, if Governor Spitzer can follow through on his plan to grant them drivers licenses. They will even have their own separate process for getting their licenses.

GOV. ELIOT SPITZER (D), NEW YORK: Undocumented immigrants will not be able to get a license in the over-the-counter manner that lawful residents currently go through. Instead, they will submit six points of identification to a central document verification unit and DMV, the first of its kind in the nation where specially trained staff will verify their validity.

TUCKER: In essence, New York State will do a background check on illegal aliens. And, no, he will not share information gathered from illegal aliens getting their license with federal immigration authorities. That is none of their business, the governor effectively says.

SPITZER: We enforce the state laws. We make sure that those who are here get the benefit of the community that we have defined by virtue of those state laws.

TUCKER: Those who oppose him, he says, are using heated rhetoric and hysterical allegations, yet he is quick to brand his opposition as anti-immigrant.

SPITZER: There has already been very significant pushback, as you've seen the nature of the rhetoric, the anti-immigrant emotions that have been fanned and preyed upon.

TUCKER: His opponents answer, saying they are not anti-immigrant but they are against rewarding people who have broken the law. And they're concerned about turning New York State into a sanctuary state.

REP. TOM REYNOLDS (R), NEW YORK: What the governor is doing is changing a program, not to provide legals. They already can submit and provide an opportunity to get a drivers license. This is illegals that are here illegally and the governor is setting up an open door.

TUCKER: There is some dispute whether Spitzer can make these changes unilaterally. Many, including the governor, believe he has the power to make the change by executive order. (END VIDEOTAPE)

TUCKER: But the New York State Republican Party has filed suit against the governor, challenging his authority, arguing that legislative action is what is required in order to carry this off. There will be a hearing here in New York City tomorrow, Kitty, of those who are opposed to this. Of course, we will be there and bring the story to you tomorrow night.

CNN — LOU DOBBS TONIGHT — Aired October 2, 2007 - 18:00 ET

KITTY PILGRIM, GUEST HOST: For a closer look at today's issues, we welcome some of the best radio talk show hosts in the country.

Warren Ballentine with Syndication 1 in Raleigh, North Carolina.

WARREN BALLENTINE, SYNDICATION 1: Good afternoon.

PILGRIM: Charles Goyette joins us from KFNX in Phoenix, Arizona.

CHARLES GOYETTE, KFNX PHOENIX: Hi, Kitty.

PILGRIM: Hi.

And Joe Madison, "The Black Eagle," from WOL in Washington, D.C. He's here in New York tonight. And thanks for being with us.

JOE MADISON, WOL, WASHINGTON, D.C.: Thank you.

Glad we could be here.

PILGRIM: And thanks for making the trip to New York.

BALLENTINE: Thank you, Kitty.

PILGRIM: Gentlemen, I'd like to start with Governor Spitzer, who has managed to raise quite a bit of controversy with his action to open up drivers licenses to illegal aliens. And, Warren, I know you've spent a good bit of time on this, discussing this. What are your viewers saying?

BALLENTINE: Well, my viewers are very upset about this. And, to be honest with you, Kitty, I'm a little concerned as a citizen and as an attorney. One of the things that I'm worried about is if they're going to issue these licenses, if they're giving these people the right to drive, if they go out and kill somebody, can we sue the State of New York? Also, the Interstate Commerce Clause is going to come into effect here, because if you're giving somebody a license, you're giving them a right to drive from state to state. And the illegal issue comes into play because if you're pulled over and you have a legal drivers license from the State of New York, you're — the question of you being here illegally may not ever be addressed because you have a legal driver's license.

PILGRIM: Yes.

BALLENTINE: And I mean it's a lot of different issues that's coming to play here with this.

PILGRIM: You know, and, certainly, Charles, you know — and, also, this document is your entree onto an airplane, isn't it?

GOYETTE: You know, Kitty, I think all of this stuff is headed toward a national I.D. card. I'm very, very sad to say that.

MADISON: Yes.

GOYETTE: I believe that's where we're going. And it is a concomitant — it is inevitability with the national security state that the Republicans and the Democrats have ushered in in this country with The Patriot Act and more.

We're headed toward a national I.D. card. We're headed to being vassals or surfs of the state. And I've looked at the field of presidential candidates. There's only one guy who's outspoken against this kind of stuff, and it's Congressman Ron Paul. He's been against this idea of a national security state for a long time. And he's starting to look more and more attractive with each passing day.

PILGRIM: Joe?

MADISON: But, you know what's really stupid about this — and I'm not going to mince words with this — is when I heard the governor today announce he's going to have a separate place for what...

BALLENTINE: Yes.

MADISON: ...illegal aliens...

BALLENTINE: Yes, that's...

MADISON: ...immigrants to go. So can you imagine if you're with the immigration service, all you have to do is just sit there and wait to see who gets in line.

PILGRIM: Well, can you imagine if the line is shorter what the (INAUDIBLE)...

MADISON: I mean, so what person who is here illegally...

PILGRIM: Right.

MADISON: ...is going to go and say, OK, legal over here, illegal over here.

(CROSSTALK)

MADISON: Who's going to do that?

GOYETTE: Right. Right.

PILGRIM: That's — it really boggles the mind how that would work out logistically.

MADISON: Well, two hours we couldn't get away from this...

PILGRIM: Oh, really?

MADISON: And not one caller — one caller — supported it. Not one.

PILGRIM: Well, that's interesting.

the real truth is that some illegals are bypassing secretary of state guidelines in obtaining a license. they may bounce around from office to office trying to obtain one till they find an "easy " one to go to. how they do it, i was informed of "using" a current cable bill to provide proff of residency in obtaining them since they don't have a social security number.
.02

Then why, praytell; is it so hard for our government officials to require a social security number for any and all such government documentation? I'm not disagreeing with you, Kitty. Here in Illinois, this is an ongoing problem. Not only are the DMV facilities constantly being checked for adherence to procedure (in light of the many incidences of laxity that has allowed licenses to be "bought" by anyone with a certain amount of money, but we have numerous political bribery scandals (former Governor Ryan, for recent example) that seem to always be ongoing.

What happens if they cheated the system and were in a gay relationship. One person was a legal and the other illegal. For the sake of argument lets say they tried to immigrate legally and could not and for reasons that may involve the person of the illegals origin and economically it made sense for themt to stay here. Is your answer the same in this instance.

Just some general observations:

The assumption that people can afford to migrate here and have the time to wait for the process which can take years whilst their family is going hungry is just dumbfounding to me. The issue of they should fix their own country (which no-one said to my ancestors when they came here from Europe btw) is a long term answer to a very real and immediate problem. Where is our compassion??? World poverty is a direct result of multi-nationals and the greed of the first world, that would include you and me btw. Poverty leads these people to commit the civil misdemeanour known as illegal presence...we create the poverty globally by virtue of our own greed.

We limit the amount of well educated people who come to this country and import unskilled labor to supplement, the thoughts behind the policy being its better to educate our own people and have others do unskilled labor. The people who perform unskilled labor may not actually be able to afford to pay the high fees and waste the time involved in coming here, is this right?? No but maybe its our laws that are wrong as opposed to people who come here looking for a better life. Its very easy when you already have that better life to attack and marginalize others.

Fact is there are at least 12 million people in this country and we have no idea who they are. Those who would be willing to come forward for a licence would be those with nothing to hide in a criminal sense, they are not criminals in other words. Illegall presence is NOT criminal but a civil law. Anything that brings people out of the shadows and lowers the cost of insurance..my current car insuance is close to $6000 a year. The cost is due to all the uninsured people in CA many of whom are illegal. Is good IMO. It is not a State Govt reponsibility to enforce Federal laws, the State should do what is best for it with regards to good and responsbile government. Knowing who people are is both good and responsbile government.

The do nothing which is what current policy is more or less has allowed inurance rates in States with a high illegal population to be out of control. Current policy also ensures that illegals are marginalized and victims of un-reported crimes which some may think is OK they deserve it but do we really want criminals attacking the weakest (politically) members of our society?? The greatness of a society is measured not by its wealth but treatment of the poorest members and like it or not these people are part of our society.