Okay onlyoneplanet, we are obviously going to both disagree on the hospitals topic, so how about this, let's agree to disagree.

Although, I am not about to agree to disagree on these next arguements. Each and every day Illegal Immigrants bring drugs into the U.S. and your saying that it's our fault. Who cares if some americans want them. They wouldn't get them if it hadn't been for the illegals.

How in the world you think it's ok for illegals to come and work in the u.s. is beyond me. Borders being "bullshit," wow I'm not even going to go into how ignorant that is.

So onto the next subject. American Bussiness in Mexico. I'm going to stick to my arguement that they give jobs to Mexicans. Your arguement: the wages suck, and there aren't any benefits. Well what do you expect? It's not like these Mexicans were getting good wages or benefits with selling stuff to people on the street. I'm not saying that them not getting benefits is a good thing i'm saying that it's a start. It's better then what they were doing as jobs. Whats with this arguement of them being forced into poverty. Again I shall raise the question: Have you ever been to Mexico? Mexico isn't as poor as most Americans think. Many Americans only judge it by what they see in Nogales/ Rocky Point. Mexico is indeed a wealthy country. There are plenty of rich people there. Cheaper corn meaning less business for corn farmers? What are you on? If the corn is cheap that means that it's going to keep being bought by American SuperMarkets. Meaning that they will continue being in business, as apposed to us not buying any corn at all.

When you say: "I'm a landscaper and I'm a whiteboy from Oro Valley, Arizona." You have just proven my point exactly: Americans do take these jobs.

About the steriotypes. You may not have directly said all Mexican's have to take bad jobs, or they are good at it. But you implied it. And what the heck is up with your little "Behind every steriotype is a grain of truth." You have jut proven another one of my arguments. This is where you are implying that Mexicans are good at doing laundry and cleaning bathrooms. You understand the steriotypes Mexicans have. And when you say this comment you are indeed implying that these steriotypes have some "Truth" to them.

The bottom line to this topic is that Illegal Immigration is Illegal, if you don't think breaking the law is a bad thing then thats your problem. You act as if it's our responsibility to make the Mexican government perfect, well I've got news for you, It's not! Go tell your arguements on NAFTA to the Mexican government.

And please if you feel like showing more ignorance in another arguement against what I'm saying, don't use profanity it just makes you appear even more ignorant then you are.

Don't worry you aren't racist. But you are right. Arguements should stop after someone says ILLEGAL. Just because you are against illegal immigration doesn't mean you are racist. I'm mexican and I'm against Illegal Immigration, how can I be racist against my own race?

My dear sir, you're about as skilled in rhetoric as a 10-year-old. Let's clear a few things up...

Keeping immigrants out of the United States has--thusfar--proven to be impossible. The only quick, efficient way to stop Americans from using drugs brought in from Mexico is boycott. What I'm saying is this; if America does not choose to stop buying Mexican weed or cocaine, you can bet that the flow of drugs into the United States will never cease, not until the druglords or mota farmers go out of business.

To say that stopping Mexicans from coming to the United States will stop Americans from using drugs is simply ridiculous. It's too far-fetched, too idealistic. See, if you take a druggie's drugs away, he'll find other ways to get them; illegals aren't the only source of drugs in America.

You may indeed hold fast to the idea that American business in Mexico has created more jobs for the Mexican working class, but you'd be deluded. What NAFTA has done has simply taken their old jobs, the work of their culture, and replaced them with jobs that dehumanize. The purpose of NAFTA was not to destroy their culture and Americanize Mexican businesses, but that seems to be what's happening.

You obviously misinterpretted my statement about the corn farmers. Here's the deal; with corn being imported into Mexico (foreign product) and sold for cheaper prices in the markets, the people who've followed the tradition of corn farming in Mexico for the past 9,000 years suddenly have no one to sell their corn to (nope, not even Americans, not as long as we gorge ourselves in our genetically modified corn, which is exported to Mexico as well). In other words, they can't compete with the prices of the imported corn. And this is happening with all different kinds of products; corn is just an example.

Now, you asked me if I've been to Mexico. My answer is yes, I have. I've seen the trashed highways and stayed in hotels where the water would run now and then, but never for long. I've seen the kids selling beads and necklaces on the streets. My brother almost had his bag stolen by a team of thieves as one distracted him as the other tried to take off with his things.

If you ask me, that sounds like something that would go on in a poor nation, not a wealthy nation as you claimed it was. You even mentioned Rocky Point and Nogales as the American's interpretation of a poor Mexico... And those are tourist spots in the borderlands, the more stable areas of Mexico. The vast majority of Mexico is indeed poor.

Do I look stupid to you? Of course Americans take these jobs, but to many it is demeaning. I simply love to work outdoors and with my hands while many prefer to work in an air-conditioned office or something similar. Especially in Tucson, where it's hot as hell throughout most of the year.

As for your comments regarding stereotypes; what I implied is that illegal immigrants who don't have the money or the paperwork to get a good job can only take the undesirable jobs (which many Americans still refuse to take). I said nothing about the Mexican people as a whole; believe me when I say I am well aware of the fact that there are wealthy/middle-class Mexicans in the United States and Mexico alike.

You missed the point that was being made with my "grain of truth" comment. It's obvious that you've never studied sociology; the stereotype does not necessarily say that Mexican women are good at doing laundry (which is certainly degrading to Mexican women). But the little truth that it does speak is that when you go to a hotel in--say--California, you can bet you'll find Mexican maids (not to be confused with "being good at doing laundry"). It isn't supposed to be a good or a bad thing. Flies tend to buzz around dungpiles, but I don't hold that against them.

Of course, there are positive, negative and neutral stereotypes, many with some sort of undeniable truth behind them. Understanding society, it's use of stereotypes, and the history behind those stereotypes is what effectively nullifies stereotypes--that's my point.

My statement "borders are bullshit" is not ignorant, but it isn't necessarily patriotic. It is anarchistic--which means to say that the world should be viewed as a whole, as a network of communities whose people do not need to be confined to specified pieces of land. A community is far more effective than a national government. I realize that this is idealistic, but I still encourage the elimination of borders, big business, government, and other corrupting institutions as a means of achieving peace and justice.

The world is like a gigantic pie, there are people who will create schemes to take more than their fair share, leaving others with little-to-nothing, even though there is more than enough to feed us all throughout our lives if we simply take what we need and respect others.

We could just legalize all drugs and stop the flow from beyond. Why not right? They are streaming in now as it is.

lol

Dear Onlyoneplanet. When I discuss the drug flow I'm simply saying that a lot of the drugs in Arizona today are from mexico, and in my opinion if we did a better job of keeping illegal immigrants out then there would certainly be a smaller amount of drugs. Yes drugies will find their ways of getting drugs, but why not make it more difficult for them?

As for the American Business in Mexico... Please explain to me how they have "taken their old jobs, the work of their culture" away? You say that American Business in Mexico has "dehumanized" the Mexican's. But how can it "dehumanize" them? Do you even know what dehumanize means? I'm assuming you don't. Here is the correct definition complements of The American Herritage Dictionary Fourth Addition: To deprive of human qualities such as individuality, compassion, or civilty: Slaves who had been dehumanized by their condition. Now how working at Wal*Mart can take away your individuality, compassion, or civilty is beyond me. I know people that work at Target, they still have their individuality.

As for the corn farmers. You still make it seem like it's our fault they are losing jobs. We aren't the ones who decided to import genetically modified corn into their country, it was the Mexican government. So if you believe that it's causing them to loose jobs then go and talk to the Mexican Government about it!

I find it incredibly entertaining how you think that if the one part of Mexico you've been to had crime then that means the whole country is poor. There are people in New York City that would do the same thing to your brother as the Mexicans you discussed. Does that make the United States poor...No! Your reasoning it quite irrational. What part of Mexico have you been to? I also find it amusing that you say Nogales and Rocky Point are the stable parts of Mexico. True they are tourist spots, but what does that have to do with anything? The vast majority is not poor my friend, perhaps you should travel more before you make such arguements!

When you say "Do I look stupid to you?" Well my answer to that is that I can't see you so how would I know, but the correct question would be "do I sound stupid to you," and my answer to that would be yes. What is your arguement if you say Americans do take these jobs? But it's demeaning you say, that is your opinion but personally I don't feel landscaping is demeaning. You even said it yourself you don't feel it is either. You have proven my point once again!

And about the stereotypes, don't give me this nonsense that what you implied was this and that. You know what you implied. Your "Grain of truth" thing was a quote that can be interpreted in many ways. Knowing sociology has nothing to do with the way one may interpret a quote. Sociology is the study of human behavior, origins, institution, and the development of human society. You are talking about different aspects of a stereotype but a stereotype is plain and simple. It's labeling different characteristics to one lifestyle, group, or race. You may think you know everything about the Mexican stereotypes but how can you, your not even Mexican. If anyone is to know of these stereotypes it's me, or even my friend who is 100% mexican. When he read your quote he felt affended. Yes there are good and bad stereotypes but by the context of our arguements it is clear that your quote was refering to the bad ones.

About the borders. I still think what you said is stupid. How can you seriously believe that borders are a bad thing? How would you like not to have a door on your house, so people can just walk in whenever they please. Saying that the elimination of borders, big businesses, and government would mean peace and justice is insane. Our government is the only thing keeping us alive. Without it you would be killed, along with myself and many other people. Government is the only thing that gives us justice. Taking away Government would mean taking away freedom! So if you think that the deaths of many American people is peace and justice then there is seriously something wrong with you and I suggest therapy! Eliminating big businesses is in itself yet another stupid idea (but coming from you this really doesn't surprise me) You wouldn't be able to go onto the internet if it wasn't for big businesses, you wouldn't have a computer, you wouldn't have all the vaccinations and antibiotics that we have if it wasn't for big businesses. If anything you should be thankful we have big businesses.

Look the bottom line to illegal immigration is that it's illegal, what part of illegal don't you understand. Perhaps you need me to define it for you?

If you feel like showing your ignorance once more in another post...please do it is very entertaining. but i'm going to be off for a week vacationing. So if i don't reply in a while that is why.

HarryPotterRocks1 is right. Illegal Immigration should not be allowed. I dont' know why you can't get that through your head. It's called Illegal Immagration for a reason. It's very simple. Very easy to understand...why can't you?

Thanks for the Support!! I'm not the only one who understands illegal immigration afterall!

There's two guys standing in a pool of gasoline, one has three matches and the other has five. Who wins?

I say let 'em jump. I'm flattered they want to come into our country.

Besides without hopping my family wouldn't be here today.