Defending the Truth

And the quintessence of an argument supported only by hate and ignorance is one centralized on sweeping generalities and personal insults.

There are radical Christians world-wide also, am I to believe that the entire Christian religion is therefore tainted with such hatred? I don't think so. If you continue reading the interview you would notice that its not just that he was raised Catholic, he continues to believe in god; hence he is a Christian (I was proving that he was a Christian because Jon said he was not one, not that his acts were religiously motivated).

Again, if you had the common decency to read and attempt to come to an understanding instead of read in an attempt at cherry picking faults for your own desperate attempt for delight at finding at least something wrong with a liberal, then you would know perfectly well that I acknowlege that the bombing wasn't an act of religion. It was "retaliation" to Waco, which has religious emotions in that argument. But as I see you continuously attempt to tie the general broad term of "terrorism" with Islam, then I found it only accurate to consider McVeigh's acts religiously motivated.

The sad thing is is that while you put the blame of "holier than thou" squarely on the shoulders of liberals, you attempt to hold Christian extremism and violence at a higher morality than that of Islamic extremism. Although there are cases of one being more extreme than the other, I believe it was my point that they (Jesus Camp and Taliban) had a lot in common in that they indoctrinate their youth to "die for their religion". Its almost sad that you can't see through the thick cloud of arrogance for your own religion that you would think one form of violence or extremism is rightous while the other evil...but then again not entirely sad because you are not a victim of ignorance but guilty of stupidity and arrogance because you have been presented the opportunity to learn.

"Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever."
-Aristophanes

Believing in God does not make you a Christian. Believing in Jesus as your savior makes you a Christian. Where did he say that? He didn't. Lots of people say they believe in God. That does not mean he bombed the building for Jesus like Islamic fascists are bombing and murdering people in the name of Allah. Every few weeks we get a video from some nut telling us to convert or die. How many Christian videos can you find saying believe in Jesus or we will kill you? Duh. You're an idiot. You have as much sense as Rosie O'Donnell for saying the same thing and she is a first class moron.

That's not entirely true of all muslim leaders. In fact as far as i recall ALL leaders of muslim nations condemned 9/11. Just like they condemn all other atrocities in the name of islam.

The only place this type of action does not get unilaterally condemned is in palestine and israel. The reasonfor that is that the struggle is seen as a nationalist struggle of a people subdued by an outside power. That changes the dynamics. And technically if you compare the number of innocent palestinians killed versus the number of palestinians, the losses are heavily weighted in favor of the palestinians. The only difference is that the Israelis have armed forces to take this sort of actions.

And Kat you are absolutely right. The teaching of violence and intolerance towards other religions is the starting of terrorism.. no matter WHAT religion is in question. The aspect of martyrdom implied by "dying for your religion" is also a very worrying aspect. from here on it is just a short distance to propogating "martyrdom" in exchange for the pleasures of heaven.

Trust me gentlemen, this type of behaviour is worrying.. no matter what religion is backing it.

Christians get insulted every day and you don't see them rioting in the streets yelling to chop people's heads off. American TV continually demeans and insults Christians and no one is harmed for it. The same TV channels will not show cartoons of muslims for fear of their life or causing a riot. I haven't seen a Christian video of a beheading yet. I haven't seen any Baptists hijack planes and fly them into buildings full of people. I haven't seen any Christians teaching their children to hate Muslims in our schools. You country is full of schools teaching the children of your nation to hate Christians and Jews. What are you doing about that?

What i am doing is far more effective than your rants dear friend.

There is no doubt that muslim fundamentalism is far more dangerous today than christian fundamentalism. But that is not so much on account of the RELIGIONS, but rather the comparative level of development in christian nations. christian nations ARE ahead and as a result there is not so much frustration and anger for unscrupulous priests to exploit. It is a social issue.

HOWEVER this thread is about how religious indoctrination ESPECIALLY the sort that exhalts those who die for their religion is DANGEROUS. It is the EXACT same mentality that reigns in the madrassas. It is this mentality that allows unscrupulous terrorists like Osama to convince people to commit suicide.

I had many friends in my hostel indenmark who used to attend these sorts of camps. And it was lovely for them. They cam out of there with greater tolerance and understanding. However they were taught about local issues and personal belief. Never about the glory of dying for your belief.

The concept of martyrdom should not be propogated among children. How can you expect a child to understand the repercussions of such a choice?

I thank god that christianity has come so far that violence inthe name of religion is pretty much history. But would you like the childrenof the next generationto go BACK to that level.. just because some OTHER idiots do it?

A religion where they are grooming the kids to be "soldiers in god's army"?
Tying in political ideology, under a picture of George Bush?
Pastor Becky Fisher: "I want to see them as radically laying down their lives for the Gospel. As they are over in Pakistan, in Israel, in Palistan, in all those different places..."


Alias. Nobody is saying they are as bad as the Islamic jihadists.
But your tactic of defending them by saying they aren't as bad as Islamic fascists is like a man trying to excuse the bad things he does by saying that he's not as bad as a mass murderer.
Jimmy tortures little animals, but don't worry. He hasn't killed anyone...

You're ignoring any discussion on whether or not their actions are proper and rational, or if they are just downright looney. (Probably somewhere inbetween...)

Hear hear, foundit.

Has anybody else seen "Jesus Camp".

I'm watching it now and it is fricken' scary.
I had hoped that maybe something in the previews had been taken out of context, but that was not the case.

They had one tidbit encouraging kids (very few parents present) to fast for multiple days for God and the bible...

And I really don't get the whole "religion" thing tying in to a stance on "global warming". I mean, the movie shows people tying their RELIGIOUS beliefs into opposition of the theory of global warming like they used to tie religious beliefs in to the "heliocentric" issue.

And on that note, one of the "home schooled" kids actually was video-taped thanking God that Galileo recanted before dying.
Unbe-fricken-lievable!

I think it was the most horrifying movie I have ever seen, and I think many of these people should be brought up on charges of child abuse.

Well... they are definately way out there... but I don't believe what they were doing constituted child abuse.