They already are, and have been since their brainwashing began.

How is this a cult? Is it as much a cult as the Amish? It seems to me it is just a part of the LDS that decided to stick with the polygamy aspect of their religion. Doesn't sound like cult to me. Just people that didn't sell out their belief to conform to society.

Especially when in this case, "society", or the Texas government in this case, changed the laws pretty much specifically to persecute them.

Young girl getting pregnnt isn't proof of abuse. As many here have said, normal is dependent on society. And in their closed society young girls can marry older men. They aren't trying to spread it to others, they aren't trying to force anyone to conform to them. They keep to themselves. And from all outward appearances, they are happy. It's not our job to "save" them. What's gonna happen to 200 women with no social skills? Welfare and social outcasts? That's some bullshit "saving" when they seemed to be doing just fine where they were.

You were born at a time and place where you don't agree with this. They were born in a place where they did. You are just proving your "tolerance" only goes so far. How hypocritical of you.

If it was a gay cult, there would be plenty of "tolerance" to go around here.

Bullshit, fx. It isn't intolerant to protect young girls from forced marriage and motherhood. It clearly meets the requirements of being a cult. Maybe you better do some reading into their actual beliefs and practices. And PN is right, if this was a community forcing their kids to practice homosexuality or sterilisation, you would be all over it. Just because men have dominated women over recorded history, doesn't make their decisions right. If men chose to marry younger girls in previous times, what were women going to do about it? They had no rights, and they don't even have the control of their own thoughts to decide to leave the cult now. Give me a break and quit trying to make it alright that this is happening to these kids. You would have a hard time convincing me that you actually believe that women should have the right to control their own destinies, you sound like one of them.

But it doesn't look like we are protecting anyone from anything. In many cultures young girls marry older men. Our own has a history of it. I HAVE read on this. And the most demeaning account come from those who didn't conform. But after debating mothers who hate their kids and women who want to abort kids that their own actions created, I have to rely on the actions of the people that are there instead of the disgruntled. And so far, I haven't heard of any 13 year old "forced" to do a damn thing. But what I DO see is 400 "well behaved and healthy" kids being ripped from their parents.
As I pointed out, these people are doing what they are doing in their own compound which corresponds to the "in their bedroom" mantra that homosexual chant. It seems that's not the criteria that works in all cases.
So far, I don't see any "abuse" going on. And I don't se any of these women trying to leave. I don't see removing these people from here unless some "real" abuse is proven. And so far, it ain't happening.

If it were a gay cult living behind the confines of their own walls, what would be the problem?

I never said gay people shouldn't be gay, just keep it to themselves, just like these people do. They are the ultimate in DADT. And very good at it obviously. They paid millions for the land they live on.

Like I said before, I'm a bit on the fence on this one. Are the children really being abused? Their beliefs are wacky, but are they really causing anybody harm? I'm not so sure what to think. However, I do have an issue with kids being taken away from their mothers. That being said, it's not entirely clear what mother(s) go with what children.

Should we have just left these people alone? Right now my heart says yes.

And with that we agree. If they prove real abuse, those guilty should be prosecuted. But early marriage isn't abuse. Especially if it's normal in a culture that they live in. They aren't circumcising girls, binding feet, fattening women, or forcing women to stretch their necks. Like I said, when they moved into Texas, the age of consent was 14, they changed the law as a knee jerk reaction to this religion. Seems like they were "made" criminals, they weren't always such.

As far as polygamy, I don't see much difference between that and my cousin who has 6 kids by 3 different women. Not to mention when he was 17, he lived with his 13 year old girlfriends' family. Just because something is illegal doesn't mean that everyone agrees with the law or abides by it.

Reminds a bit of Waco. Yeah, they had guns, but didn't use them until the government fucked with them. THis is a tough call. At what point do you declare religous stupidity illegal?

Here is an article that might shed some light on the things the FLDS are doing and have done. See if you think that is okay, and not a cult.

Saturday, April 12, 2008

Expert: FLDS Polygamist Group is A Classic Cult



KTAR - Arizona
April 11, 2008

by Jim Cross

The raid on a polygamist compound in Texas could signal the beginning of the end of a lifestyle that has flown under the radar in America, according to an expert on cults. The Fundamentalist Church of Latter-day Saints, which operates the compound near Eldorado, Texas, along with other communities around the country -- including Colorado City, Ariz. -- fits the classic criteria of a cult, according to Rick Ross.
He says there are about 50,000 polygamists living in North America and Mexico.
``The level of harm done by polygamist groups is horrific, and, in particular, this group (FLDS) has a long history of very seriously damaging children through sexual abuse, neglect and physical abuse."
More than 400 children were taken from the Texas compound after authorities received a phone call from a 16-year-old girl, who said she had been forced to marry an older man and have his child. Arizona authorities received a similar call from a 16-year-old girl in Colorado City, but authorities said they had no power to act on the unverified call.
These children come from a ``world within our world," completely controlled by the church group, according to Ross.``Without television, without newspapers, without all the things that kids grow up with these days. All information, all associations, everything around them controlled by the organization."
The harm done to children by the FLDS church, whose leader Warren Jeffs is jailed on sex charges in Kingman, is amazing, Ross says.
As soon as children reach puberty, Ross says, ``they become so much like a commodity that has literally been passed from one community to another community... The child can be married off, her husband can take her as so much property. She is obliged to obey him and submit to him, even if he's violent, even if he's abusive."
The cult expert says, ``Out of all the groups called cults in North American that I've dealt with, some of the most horrific complaints of sexual and physical abuse have come from these polygamist groups."
He said the children taken from such groups ``are going to need counseling, they're going to need help," adding, ``The youngest children will probably do the best because they've had the least time in the group."
Jeffs' group has been funded for years by taxpayers who didn't know it, Ross says.
``Seventy percent of the people in Colorado City were on food stamps, 40 percent of the women were receiving assistance through a WIC (women's and children ) fund."
The group also got money ``through state funds, through federal funds which were accumulated for infrastructure within their township."
``When they began to basically clamp down on this group for its illegal activities, it had accumulated assets in excess of $200-million dollars," he said. ``So this was a group that grew very rich, very powerful, often through taxpayers' money." (my highlight.wt)
Attorneys general from Arizona and Utah made a significant impact in the last few years when they went after Jeffs, ultimately getting Utah convictims against him for rape by accomplice in arranging marriages of under-aged girls, Ross said. Jeffs now is jailed in Kingman, awaiting trial on similar Arizona charges.
Besides physical and sexual abuse, ``there have also been violations of child labor laws, repeatedly," Ross said. ``Children as young as 12 working in dangerous circumstances with machinery that they have no business operating."
Ross said he's encouraged by the actions of Texas authorities.
``With the law now effectively going after them, their era seems to be coming to an end."
This article was found at:

http://ktar.com/?nid=6&sid=803901