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Religion What is your take on religion? Do you base your thoughts in life according to your religion? Do you feel that religion should be kept out of Government and Politics?

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Old 06-28-2008, 08:23 PM   #131 (permalink)
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God is Love
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Originally Posted by cactusman View Post
1. We have all sinned and fall short of the glory of God.-Romans 3:23
This means that we are not perfect, like God, and have died spiritually. We must be born again in the spirit. Also, the Bible tells that the rai nfalls on the righteous as well the wicked. This allow non believers to see that bad things happen to everyone, and that Christians are not loved, by God, anymore than nonbelievers.
So non believers see that bad things happen to everyone...er...why is that they should become believers then? Is there a way to actually tell which religion is true that doesn't involve taking someone else's word for it or believing one particular holy book off of a stack of holy books that all claim to be truth? Why is it that an individual person's religion seems to be more a factor of where they were born than say intelligence and the capability to select a single obvious truth from obvious lies?
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2. How do you know that God doesn't answer prayers? Is it ironic that so many highly ecucated doctors and physicians are Christians? They see miraculous healings often, especially those in cancer wards. There are hunderds of cases of AIDs patients in Africa being healed from their sickness. Explain that.
I don't know that God doesn't answer prayers, I just know that if he does he is rather random in his choices of which prayers he grants. People still die in horrible ways, their severed limbs don't grow back and no amount of praying seems to bring the dead back to life. So there's the problem...either God can't answer the prayers of the truly needy or he won't...this tells me he either doesn't exist, is impotent, evil or negligent. Which is it?
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3. The Bible preaches no hatred. It does preach against lying, infidelity, adultery, sodomy, murder, cheating, disobeying authority, and worshiping molded images.
This is the same God that killed damn near everything on the planet right? Please ask him not to love us that much again.
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4. God is not one of death and blood. He loves us and died for our sins. He came down for heaven, lived a poor man's life, was tempted in all ways as we are, helped hundereds, performed dozens of miracle, and then was beaten and nailed to a cross. He did all this so we could go to heaven and be with Him. He loved us first before we loved Him.
I'm sorry I'm having a hard time hearing you over the screams of the Amalakite children butchered by the direct command of your love God.
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4. We could speak of the atrocities that pagans have done to thier own people for thousands of years. The god Molech comes to mind. Ancient pagans would throw their conscious babies and children into pits of raging fire. They watch and chant as the flesh of their own children would burn off. You wonder why God commanded the Israelites to leave not one Amelikite. Also, Romans threw early Christians into pits of hungry lions and burned them at the stake.
I thought all the other gods are false? That is your position isn't it? So anyone who kills, murders, rapes or whatever for another god is just stupid and acting on their own authority. The one, true God however orders his followers to rape, kill and destroy in his name...this is that God of love you were talking about before...the one who loves everyone equally. By claiming the god of the Bible is the only true god, you have to admit that all evil acts are ultimately his responsibility. Why did he not stop the pagans before they threw their children into the fire? Why did he need to slaughter the Amalakites instead of just sending them a vision or prophet to change their attitude? Nope...had to kill them as all powerful as he is and he can't think of any other option than death and destruction. How can you possibly refer to it as anything other than a god of blood and death?
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I can go tit for tat if you like. I would that you bring something intelligent.
The problem is that you have to invoke special pleading on your evil deity's behalf in order to justify the millions killed in his name. I don't make the claim that anyone else worships the one true god...although I can name any number that are infinitely more worthy of worship than your bronze-age demon.
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Old 06-28-2008, 08:29 PM   #132 (permalink)
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Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that there were multiple truths. I was trying to get across the idea that it seems everyone has their own different notion of the truth. The christians are no longer powerful enough to torture and kill those who don't agree with them on the scale necessary to force us to pretend we believe. That also means that if they choose to spout their crazy blood god worship in public they do so at the risk of having their zany beliefs mocked.
Old 06-28-2008, 09:07 PM   #133 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tirya View Post
I haven't dodged anything - I've answered your question on more than one occasion. The fact that you don't like my answer is your problem, not mine.

Ref: posts #91, #103
I re-read those posts, you didn't explain why these supposed gods seem to have lost all their supporters!

Apart from a handful of Greeks whom you allege brought a court case giving them the right to worship these forgotten figures.

I've never disputed the rights of anyone to worship anything.

You still haven't explained why these mythical gods have drifted into the sands of time whilst the one and only true God of Judea-Christianity continues to be the object of fiath for billions of people over thousands of years.

If you can't come up with a good reason then it's ok to admit it.
Old 06-28-2008, 09:11 PM   #134 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Grace View Post
Why dont you just answer the question??
I think we all know why she won't answer the question Grace!
Old 06-28-2008, 09:13 PM   #135 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by tadpole256 View Post
I agree with you all the way to the end where you seem to indicate that there is more than one truth. There can only be one truth, it is not relative. That is why it is so important that we don't try to soften our stance against religious people. The mere fact that they partake in a fantasy does not afford them any special protections, at least it shouldn't. People must face reality. This massive delusion being suffered by the religious right is not something that we should try to dance around in the name of being polite. It is harming our society, and we must try to educate these people.
Massive delusion??

Tad you risk missing the game because you're too busy watching a fight amongst the crowd!

Just because many people have committed sins in the name of God doesn't mean that God doesn't exist or isn't omniscient, omnipotent and omnipresent.

Instead of trying to find the errors why not try to seek the truth?
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Old 06-28-2008, 10:32 PM   #136 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garysher View Post
Massive delusion??

Tad you risk missing the game because you're too busy watching a fight amongst the crowd!

Just because many people have committed sins in the name of God doesn't mean that God doesn't exist or isn't omniscient, omnipotent and omnipresent.

Instead of trying to find the errors why not try to seek the truth?
I wonder when I will hear how and who I should worship. Nobody seems to claim anything other than the same old song, "Christians did bad things. The church is bad. Why won't God beckon to my every whim." This iswhat everyone wnats, right? They want God, the King of the universe, to come down and become your personal genie. Poof! What do need? Maybe if they tried searching for Him rather than continually trying to prove that He doesn't exist, which is what they're trying to do, search Him out.

God told Abraham that his descendants would inhabit this land again and take it back, because it belongs to them. God also told him that He would reach out to Amelekites, as well as the other surrounding tribes, but they would not soften their hearts. They need to read the book of Jonah. The y also need to read the epistles. God does reach out to pagans often, but the pagans would rather kill their children..
They all seem to be experts on the matter. How interesting that they attack only Christianity. Don't they know that Buddhism is a rejection of Hinduism?
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Old 06-29-2008, 12:59 AM   #137 (permalink)
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Looking to buy hammer and nails
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Originally Posted by cactusman View Post
I wonder when I will hear how and who I should worship.
Nice way to play the martyr card. Why don't you scroll back to message one and see how this whole thread started because a Christian decided to tell the forum how he had the only true god. Nobody has told you who to worship, but some folks have objected quite loudly to having holier-than-thou Christians telling us who we should be worshiping.
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Nobody seems to claim anything other than the same old song, "Christians did bad things. The church is bad. Why won't God beckon to my every whim." This iswhat everyone wnats, right? They want God, the King of the universe, to come down and become your personal genie. Poof! What do need?
Maybe your friend god should stop making promises he has no intention of delivering. What was the line again? Oh yeah...John 14:13: Whatever you ask in My name that I will do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
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Maybe if they tried searching for Him rather than continually trying to prove that He doesn't exist, which is what they're trying to do, search Him out.
How very sanctimonious of you. You assume than anyone who doesn't share your belief has never honestly looked for spiritual enlightenment. If you really believed in what you say you follow you'd be on your knees praying that the blind heathens would be enlightened; but you'd obviously rather come here and stroke your own ego instead.
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God told Abraham that his descendants would inhabit this land again and take it back, because it belongs to them. God also told him that He would reach out to Amelekites, as well as the other surrounding tribes, but they would not soften their hearts. They need to read the book of Jonah. The y also need to read the epistles. God does reach out to pagans often, but the pagans would rather kill their children..
Your God seems quite adept at killing pagan children himself or at least ordering his faithful to do it. Tell me, how hard were the hearts of those baby Amalakites? Not harder than the sharp bronze of the righteous soldiers that slaughtered them obviously. You and I have different ideas of what a hardened heart is. I'm glad I don't have your kind of heart that can sit there and make excuses for something that would slaughter children and pretend to be holy. I bet you read that chapter every night. Do you go to sleep, drowsily smiling and hoping for the day the God of Love calls you to show your faith by killing children? Sweet dreams.
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They all seem to be experts on the matter. How interesting that they attack only Christianity. Don't they know that Buddhism is a rejection of Hinduism?
I haven't noticed any Buddhists around here telling me how they have the only true religion. Could that possibly have something to do with it?

If you want to make a polite case for your faith then go ahead, you might even find a polite conversation if you simply show the same respect for others that you would like to have shown to you. Did you read the part in that book of yours about the Golden Rule...it's a really good idea, and not the only one in the thing if you can tear yourself away from the slaughtering, rape and bigotry in the other parts.

But if you'd rather whine about how poor Christians are so hated and despised go right ahead. I don't despise Christians, but I could make an exception just for you if you like.
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Old 06-29-2008, 01:47 AM   #138 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Tanndarr View Post
Nice way to play the martyr card. Why don't you scroll back to message one and see how this whole thread started because a Christian decided to tell the forum how he had the only true god.
Wrong.

The thread started with a banal and rather naive little video clip which tried to reduce God to man's puny level of reasoning.

Read post #5 for a demolition job on the original video
Old 06-29-2008, 01:52 AM   #139 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Tanndarr View Post
I don't know that God doesn't answer prayers, I just know that if he does he is rather random in his choices of which prayers he grants. People still die in horrible ways, their severed limbs don't grow back and no amount of praying seems to bring the dead back to life. So there's the problem...either God can't answer the prayers of the truly needy or he won't...this tells me he either doesn't exist, is impotent, evil or negligent. Which is it?

What makes you think it has to be any of your options?

You get frustrated because God doesn't happen to conform to your trivial and naive image of what He should be.

Just because you can't understand God doesn't mean He doesn't exist.




The problem is that you have to invoke special pleading on your evil deity's behalf in order to justify the millions killed in his name.

Nobody's 'invoking' and 'special pleading'.

Trying to convince yourself that God doesn't exist because you don't like the fact that people are sinful is rather childish.




I don't make the claim that anyone else worships the one true god...although I can name any number that are infinitely more worthy of worship than your bronze-age demon.
Again, you get angry and frustrated because God is far too complex a concept for you to begin to grasp.
Old 06-29-2008, 03:01 AM   #140 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garysher View Post
Again, you get angry and frustrated because God is far too complex a concept for you to begin to grasp.

How could a singular idea measuring everything to the smallest amount be so hard if it where true?
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