Why Not Just Be-Head Them? - Page 5

Jefferson · 12-02-2006, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katczinsky

The Old Testament is in the Bible is it not? Christians therefore believe it to be the word of God, do they not? It is therefore Christianity. Otherwise, why is it in the bible?

Christians consider the 10 commandments a moral code and law whereby they live their lives. The 10 commandments are old testament law. If the old testament law is not Christianity, then the 10 commandments are not Christianity, according to you. You can't pick and choose some old testament law and not others, that is unfair, and according to Christianity, would be ignoring equally divine word, and therefore punishable by death by stoning.

I know Christianity, as I was a Christian. And I am not judging Islam and its beliefs, but rather organized religion all together. And like you know Islam?

According to your own logic, you are arrogant and ignorant. Because you are calling me ignorant for claiming to know what Christianity believes and what Islam believes.

That was a very weak argument, with little to no merit at all. How do you know if I know or do not know Christianity and Islam? In fact, it's only foundation was on assumption, that I, a former Christian, do not know anything about these two religions and therefore basing my judgments on ignorance. You couldn't be more wrong, and in fact I refute this very line of thinking in my previous post if you had actually read it. I said it was illogical, ignorant, and arrogant to assume that either religion are "evil" simply based on the violent actions of a few.

Hence, those Muslims that are protesting the Pope are ignorant, Muslims that think Christianity is evil because of the US invasions are ignorant, and JayD and yourself are ignorant for calling Islam evil because of 9/11.

Wow. That was a whole lot of "I'm going to publicly display my ignorance!" tripe.

First of all, I don't think Christians uphold the "old covenant - aka the old testament". There IS a reason there's an "old testament" and a "new testament".

The 10 Commandments do NOT talk about "murding people in the name of Allah." They are actually laws/rules that are upheld by every civilized society in the world.

Furthermore, you obviously know NOTHING about the beginnings of Islam, and core teachings of Muhammad. It is historical FACT that Muhammad - after his flight to Medina - became a murderous warlord who attacked caravans, raped and murdered people, plundered cities, and LED his followers to do the same.

The guy married a 6-year old girl, and "consumated" the marriage when she was 9, for crying out loud!

Let's see: Murderer. Thief. Violent warlord. Pedophile. What else shall we add to the "wonderful" qualities of Muhammad?

If you cannot understand that, it simply exposes your ignorance - nothing else.

alias · 12-02-2006, 05:47 PM

Here are some teachings of Muhammed:

Qur’an 5:51 “Muslims, do not make friends with any but your own people.”

Qur’an 5:72 “They are surely infidels who say; ‘God is the Christ, the Messiah, the son of Mary.”

Qur’an 8:12 cp. 8:60 “Instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers”; “smite above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them”

Qur’an 2:191 “...kill the disbelievers wherever we find them”

Qur’an 9.33 He it is Who sent His Apostle with guidance and the religion of truth, that He might cause it to prevail over all religions.

Qur’an 2:193 “And fight with them until there is no persecution, and religion should be only for Allah”

Qur’an 8:71 And if they intend to act unfaithfully towards you, so indeed they acted unfaithfully towards Allah before, but He GAVE YOU MASTERY OVER THEM

Qur’an 8:55 Surely the vilest of animals in Allah’s sight are those who disbelieve.

Qur’an 22:19-22 “fight and slay the Pagans, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem” “for them (the unbelievers) garments of fire shall be cut and there shall be poured over their heads boiling water whereby whatever is in their bowels and skin shall be dissolved and they will be punished with hooked iron rods”

Qur’an 48:13 Those who “believe not in Allah and His Messenger, He has prepared, for those who reject Allah, a Blazing Fire!”

Qur’an 3:54 “‘Lord, we believe in Your revelations (the Torah and Gospels) and follow this Apostle (Jesus). Enroll us among the witnesses.’ But the Christians contrived a plot and Allah did the same; but Allah’s plot was the best.”

Qur’an 8:12 “Your Lord inspired the angels with the message: ‘I will terrorize the unbelievers. Therefore smite them on their necks and every joint and incapacitate them. Strike off their heads and cut off each of their fingers and toes.”

Qur’an 8:58 “If you apprehend treachery from any group on the part of a people (with whom you have a treaty), retaliate by breaking off (relations) with them. The infidels should not think they can bypass (Islamic law or the punishment of Allah). Surely they cannot escape.”

Qur’an 8:7 “Allah wished to confirm the truth by His words: ‘Wipe the infidels (non-Muslims) out to the last.’”

Qur’an 8:39 “So, fight them till all opposition ends and the only religion is Islam.”

Qur’an 8:59 “The infidels should not think that they can get away from us. Prepare against them whatever arms and weaponry you can muster so that you may terrorize them. They are your enemy and Allah’s enemy.”

Qur’an 8:60 “Prepare against them (non-Muslims) whatever arms and cavalry you can muster that you may strike terror in the enemies of Allah (non-Muslims), and others besides them not known to you. Whatever you spend in Allah’s Cause will be repaid in full, and no wrong will be done to you.”

Qur’an 8:7 “Allah wished to confirm the truth by His words: ‘Wipe the infidels (non-Muslims) out to the last.’”

Qur’an 4:101 “The unbelievers (non-Muslims) are your inveterate foe.”

Qur’an 8:60 “Prepare against them (non-Muslims) whatever arms and cavalry you can muster that you may strike terror in the enemies of Allah (non-Muslims), and others besides them not known to you. Whatever you spend in Allah’s Cause will be repaid in full, and no wrong will be done to you.”

Bukhari:V4B56N814 “There was a Christian who embraced Islam and he used to write the revelations for the Prophet. Later on he returned to Christianity again he used to say: ‘Muhammad knows nothing but what I have written for him.’”

Qur’an 9.28 O you who believe! the idolaters are nothing but unclean, so they shall not approach the Sacred Mosque (Mecca) after this year; and if you fear poverty then Allah will enrich you out of His grace if He please; surely Allah is Knowing Wise.
NOTE: In 631 A.D. (less than one year before his death, Muhammad had a revelation. No infidels allowed into Mecca (9:2

. This also included the idolators, i.e., the orginal rock worshippers of the Kabaa who had not submitted to Islam. They were history, what few were left by this time.

Qur’an 9.29 Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

Qur’an 9.30 And the Jews say: Uzair (Ezra) is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!

Qur’an 47:4 “Strike off the heads of the disbelievers”; and after making a “wide slaughter among them, carefully tie up the remaining captives.”

Hadith Sahih Muslim (41:6985) Abu Huraira reported Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying:
The last hour would not come unless the Muslims will fight against the Jews and the Muslims would kill them until the Jews would hide themselves behind a stone or a tree and a stone or a tree would say: Muslim, the servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me; come and kill him; but the tree Gharqad would not say, for it is the tree of the Jews.

Here are some teachings of Jesus:

And seeing the multitudes, He went up on a mountain, and when He was seated His disciples came to Him. 2Then He opened His mouth and taught them, saying:

"Blessed are the poor in spirit,
For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are those who mourn,
For they shall be comforted.
Blessed are the meek,
For they shall inherit the earth.

Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness,
For they shall be filled.
Blessed are the merciful,
For they shall obtain mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart,
For they shall see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers,
For they shall be called sons of God.
Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness' sake,
For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

"Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake. 12Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

I see a good man and a bad man. What do you see?

demoCRYrepubLIEcan · 12-02-2006, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alias

The entire Quran is the teaching of muhammed who was a man of war and a pedophile. He hated Christians and Jews. Jesus did not hate anyone. I stand by that. Prove me wrong

Mohammed was a pedophile? That's new. I've never heard that one before, even from extreme Islam-haters. And I believe Mohammed called Christians and Jews, "children of the book," meaning that all three religions were bound by the common thread of Abraham. So, no, I don't believe you are correct in saying that Mohammed hated Christians and Jews.

Arguing the wartime history of anyone, whether they be Muslim or Christian proves nothing. Attributing traits of long dead people to people today is simply an easy justification of ones own formed opinion. Plus, we have only a passing knowledge of the circumstances surrounding such things. Both religions have bloody histories, and the only bearing it has on today is that neither one is willing to learn from their own mistakes. I don't know, maybe they don't want to. Keeping the debate to today, you can find equal examples of violent extremism from both Muslims and Christians. All you have to do is look to Palestine/Israel conflict, and the conveniently forgotten Catholic/Protestant conflict in Ireland. Ask either of those regions how their religions are working out for them. Ask Nigeria how non-violent Christians and Muslims are.

I think all of these problems come from one source, and it is not the everyday, practicing religious people. it is the leaders who exploit the easy target of religion to further their own evil. Both Islam and Christianity have been hijacked by leadership that cares more about power and wealth than about serving their philosophy or their people. It's time the everyday people did something about that.

alias · 12-02-2006, 05:58 PM

Muhammed told his followers to kill the Jew and the Christian. Jesus told his followers to love all people.

Qur’an 9.30 And the Jews say: Uzair (Ezra) is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!

Qur’an 47:4 “Strike off the heads of the disbelievers”; and after making a “wide slaughter among them, carefully tie up the remaining captives.”

Looks to me the muslims are only doing what their holy book says to do. Can you find me any words of Jesus telling his followers to kill any unbelievers or chop off their heads?

Jefferson · 12-02-2006, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by demoCRYrepubLIEcan

Mohammed was a pedophile? That's new. I've never heard that one before, even from extreme Islam-haters.
He married a 6-year old girl named Aisha - and "consummated" the marriage when she was 9. What would YOU call it?

And I believe Mohammed called Christians and Jews, "children of the book," meaning that all three religions were bound by the common thread of Abraham. So, no, I don't believe you are correct in saying that Mohammed hated Christians and Jews.
You'd be wrong about that too. Muhammad learned a great deal, while in Medina, by debating with both the Jews and Christians in that area. That is why you see so much "Bible" stuff in the Koran. But when the majority of them refused to "convert" and recognize him as a prophet, Muhammad began to hate them. American Thinker: Muhammad and the Jews

Arguing the wartime history of anyone, whether they be Muslim or Christian proves nothing. Attributing traits of long dead people to people today is simply an easy justification of ones own formed opinion.
Those who are not smart enough to learn from history...
At this point in your argument, you're just conceding and giving up - exusing everything Muslim.

Plus, we have only a passing knowledge of the circumstances surrounding such things. Both religions have bloody histories, and the only bearing it has on today is that neither one is willing to learn from their own mistakes.
The main difference? The violence, hatred and bloodshed of Islam is NOT HISTORY. IT CONTINUES TODAY

I don't know, maybe they don't want to. Keeping the debate to today, you can find equal examples of violent extremism from both Muslims and Christians.
Give us some examples of Christians killing people, and engaging in suicide bombings "In the name of Jesus!"
Just today I saw a group of people (I assume Christians) protesting in front of a Planned Parenthood clinic. They were simply standing there with their posters - not violent, not abusive, not murderous.
Are these the kind of people you consider Christian Terrorists?

All you have to do is look to Palestine/Israel conflict, and the conveniently forgotten Catholic/Protestant conflict in Ireland. Ask either of those regions how their religions are working out for them. Ask Nigeria how non-violent Christians and Muslims are.
Or ask the Southern Sudanese people how they're being treated by the Muslim government - or the Darfur region.

I think all of these problems come from one source, and it is not the everyday, practicing religious people. it is the leaders who exploit the easy target of religion to further their own evil.
Partially true.

Both Islam and Christianity have been hijacked by leadership that cares more about power and wealth than about serving their philosophy or their people.
Half true. But this does NOT apply to Christianity today. In fact, it seems to me that the "Christians" of America have turned their backs on the Republican Party - evidencing their departure from that ideology. Additionally, I'd like you to give NAMES of these supposed RADICAL CHRISTIAN LEADERS who have hijacked the religion. And I'd like to see evidence of the violence begotten by their followers.
Can't do it? I didn't think so.

It's time the everyday people did something about that.
That's what I'm doing right now: Combatting ignorance.

You need to learn history.

alias · 12-02-2006, 06:47 PM

Maybe you guys who think Islam and Christianity are the same could find me some Christians around who are bombing stores who provide the internet and music.

World Tribune.com -- 'Swords of Islam' attack music, Internet stores in Gaza

alias · 12-02-2006, 06:51 PM

Here are muslims who want to not be held accountable for rape. Can you find me some Christians who are in mass demonstrating against rape laws?

Muslims demand rape law reverse | The World | The Australian