Originally Posted by sear

The "post", but not the thread.
Thank you Preacherman. That's subtle affirmation perhaps, but grudging affirmation is often the most sincere. I find your implied endorsement rewarding.

Because despite repeated, articulate protestations to the contrary, as a boy I was, for years, forced to Unitarian church against my will.
And that is the message they preached. We studied some other religions a bit, but I got the impression that was not merely a Unitarian teaching, but a Christian teaching.
If you think they are wrong, that's fine.

Do you presume I believe in "Heaven"?
Why would what I believe matter?
Isn't it THEIR religion?
Why not ask them?

Yes indeed sir. For agnostics, they all are.

It just ain't so hk.
There's a Mormon that's seeking the Republican nomination for U.S. President in the '08 race (Romney).
He's singing the religious conservative Republican party line, item for item, issue for issue. He's against women's reproductive rights. He's against same sex marriage, and on down the line. And yet his poll numbers are in the tank.
Why?
Could it possibly be that Christians are simply too suspicious of the Church of Jesus Christ & latter day saints, to embrace & endorse the candidate whose platform is most like their own?

I happen to think quite well of Mormons. Sen. Orin Hatch (R-UT) is a Mormon.
I don't agree with Hatch on every issue. But I don't devalue his Christianity because he's a Mormon.

If the "crybaby" portions of his posts were omitted, what would be left?

ref. Romney:
Romney Finds Deep Pockets in Heart of Mormon Country -- Beliefnet.com

Originally Posted by sear

That's not peaceful.

I'm w/ you 100% on this one Brut.
The Republicans are notorious for this.
They are forever trying to impose their religious will upon us by force of government arms.
- They do so about a woman's right of choice.
- They do so about same sex marriage.
- They do so about prayer in U.S. government schools.
And there's no evidence they'll ever stop their unrelenting clamor for a more oppressive, ever more theological U.S.A.

\.

Originally Posted by sear

Yup.
It's like the Vaudeville joke:

Pedestrian to doorman:
"Call me a taxi!"

Doorman to pedestrian:
"OK, you're a taxi."

Originally Posted by sear

If they ever say it to me, I'll tell them:

I'm not the one making the extraordinary supernatural claims without a single shred of evidence.
Your bizarre, fantastic assertions are groundless; and the burden of proof is entirely upon YOU.

You do not owe them an explanation of reality Brut.
It is not your job to educate them.

Earth has been infested with these delusional miscreants since the onset of civilization.
They are here now.
They will be here after we are gone.

Start likin' it.

Originally Posted by hkbajwa

Are they sinners because of their actions OR are they sinners because they are not christians? Is anybody who is not a christian a sinner by default? We are ALL sinners. We are all slaves to sin until the day we die. Christains, Muslims, Jews, everyone. All in need of a salvation.


Yeah but your belief is (do correct me if i'm wrong) that unless people "turn", or accept christ in their lives, they ar excluded from privelige in the afterlife. Incidentally that exclusion is based NOT on their actions in this life, but rather on their affiliation and their stated religion. Its true that Christians believe people who havent accepted Christ will not go to heaven. But that really doesnt have a lot to do MY relationship with people. Wether or not they go to heaven is between them and God. All I can do is shine the light, and be a friend. I'll only tell people about Jesus when they are open to discuss it. I do get in trouble some times cause there is only one way to find out if there open to it, if you dig what im saying. For someone to acuse me of excluting people, is rediculas.

Now if you could tell me that you are out conselling others to act righteously WITHOUT stating that affiliation is a MUST, then i would say that you are including outsiders.
You getting me all wrong. Its not about affiliation, its about personal relationships. Not even, its really more about shining your light. If they accept the truth Great. If not, maybe they will later, all I can do is be a friend, and a example.
However my understanding is that in order to be 'saved" you have accept christ first in order to even be ELIGIBLE for entry to heaven. AFTER that your actions are judged.
If you accept Christ as your savor, your sins are forgiven of you. Your judgment is more of a cleansing, cause your dept to the law is covered (paid for) by his blood. This is all true. That doesnt me that I cant befriend someone who doesnt believe. Most people I know dont believe.
Mullahs try to feed us this crap too. According to mainsream Islam, you have to be a MUSLIM before you can even be eligible for consideration for entry into heaven.

As far as i am concerned, a man is jusdged ONLY on his actions. NOT on what religion he professes, nor on what prophet he believes in nor anything else.
I can dig what your saying. The way Christians see it, we are all evil. Everything about us is evil before God. So not by works can one go to heaven, but by recognizing there is nothing I can do to deserve heaven. Understanding that its through his Grace alone, that we can be given such a gift.

Stop being such a crybaby preacher.. No man of god ever bitched about his lot in life, so quit your persecution complex for a minute will you.
Im not bitching about my lot in life. In fact you have no idea how greatfull I am. None the less this whole thread is to directly persecute christians. If you cant see that, I dont know what to tell you.
Our argument is against organized religion (no matter which one) which eventually ends up being more about "taking sides" than about following the word of God.